😀😇🤓🧐Very Great Video. I tried some weeks, to get my Viessmann signals started. Now everythings works fine. You are my new best friend and lifesaver. Hope there are not so much failures in my english. Greetings from Hannover/ Germany Ralf
Hallo.. just wondering, how many m84 can we connect as an array for a layout.. currently I have 14xm84 and they are flip flop randomly once a loco is running. Thank u
Hi, I must admit I am not sure what the limit is and the manual does not specify a limit. However, if you see something flip flop randomly something does not sound right... However, this may not be due to the amount of m84s you can connected. It could be that you generally use to much power on your layout. If you have a CS3 or MS3 try to monitor the power consumption as shown in this video: th-cam.com/video/UuVuEenZn98/w-d-xo.html If you are close to the limit then this might be the issue. To be sure I would recommend to be around 80% of consumption as power consumption changes (e.g. when turnouts/signals change) and the digital signals can be delicate. It could also be your wirering on the layout. How close to the MS2/CS3 have you taken the power to the m84s? how long is the wire from the MS2/CS3 to the M84. If the m84 gets too far away you could have a degradation in the power and digital signal. It could also be that the array is too long - try and divide it and see if this changes behaviour. Do remember that you can connect extra power directly to the m84 as well. I have not tried it, but the manual states "The decoder can also be connected to the 66360/66365 switched mode power pack (only in conjunction with 60822) (here power is not taken from the track and the power demanded from the track is thereby less). ". Check out the manual for the Marklin 60842 (black edition) here: static.maerklin.de/damcontent/46/23/46232662a863dd86dbcd0291ea519cdf1650956214.pdf Hope this helps! Enjoy ;-)
Hi Bo, you make very good instruction video's, thanks. I have a question if you could consider the following. I personally have great difficulty in understanding the way the CV system works. e.g. I have (black and white) M84's, In my system, I like to change the brightness of one of the traffic lights. Whatever I do, I cannot get it done. and on top of that I have read that CV 79 is the default, but have no clue on how to activate this. I am looking for a step by step explanation on how to work with CV's, as this will give me a lot of possibilities to work with. At this moment I am to scary to work with it. From your presentation I understand that it is no rocket science. some basic instruction video's on this would be very useful. I would highly appreciate if you would have the time and energy to assist on this. Rene
Hi Rene, The CV 79 only exists for the 60842 (the black m84) - not for the 60841 (white m84). If you want to reset the 60841 (white m84) then write 8 in CV8 i.e. CV8=8. Like you I have not had any success in making the m84 dim (change brightness). To me it makes sense if it cannot do that as the m84 really is a physical relay. The only trickery I have been able to do is to make a light blink. I do this by: - CV8=8 (Reset) - CV33=8 (Change to use 8 addresses) - CV112=2 (set to Blink 2 mode) - CV114=2 (set to blink every 2 seconds) The make an accessory for the address of the first output and set to type "Yellow" on the "Light" tab. When you turn on the yellow light, then it will blink every 2 sec. You can make the other outputs blink as well, by choosing one of the pairs (1 Red=CV112/CV114, 1 Green=CV115/CV117, 2Red=CV118/CV120, ..., 4 Green=CV133/CV135) It seems the blinking only works when you have the m84 configured for 8 addresses - not for 4 addresses. How did I figure this out? Well, the issue is that Märklin has not documented this too well. Hence, I used trial and error until I found something that works. The m83 manual below can give some hints and the CV template you can load in the CS3 also gives some hints. There is a CV38 which is specified as brightness of hobby signal. The hobby signal uses the special connector below. I do not have a hobby signal, so I have not tried this. If you look in the manual for the m83 on page 22: static.maerklin.de/damcontent/3b/44/3b44f7c3c18c5d0a2b0c3e377f3df7281570606458.pdf Then you can see all the functions for the m83. It indicates you can use the m83 as dimmer. However, I have not tried this. Hope this helps! Enjoy ;-)
Extensive programming is also possible using the m83. Unfortunately the switch group functionality is not available in the m83. Unsure on how to gain same type of functionality with the m83. I might make a video on this in the future. Enjoy ;-)
Great video, thanks. Can you make a video explaining the connection of the Marklin m84 to a Viessman Block Signal 4011 and the Viessman Digital-Bremsmodul (brake-module) 5232, in order to have trains stopping in front of a red signal keeping sound and lights on and departing at a green signal? Many thanks. My best regards and congratulations for you videos. Mario Decca
Hi Mario, There is a video showing how to connect the Viessmann 4011 to the m84: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html Unfortunately, I do not have a Viessmann 5232 brake module. If I look in the manual: viessmann-modell.com/media/pdf/a3/fc/9a/5232-pdfr1DUBw5icOLyK.pdf Look at figure 1 - it shows the "STOP (S)" input as the one controlling if the brake module brakes or not. This is further explained in section 3 where it states 'The digital brake module detects the signal aspect via socket “S” '. In section 4 it states 'If the signal is set to “stop” the module is activated by the lack of track voltage. ' So to me it seems the braking module initiates the brake when no voltage is connected to the "S STOP". This means you should be able to test out the brake module by wiring it up as show in Figure 1 - but without connecting the wire going to the signal and to the spot after the "emergency stop" section (you still need the wire from S to the "emergency STOP" section). In this way when a locomotive arrives it should brake. If this is the case you can try to also connect S to a Red wire of a live track (or to the Red on the track after the "emergency stop" section). Then the locomotive should not break. If all works as I predict above, then I would suggest you connect the Viessmann 4011 as described in the video under chapter "Track: Connect 4011 home block" - see here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html&t=1293s Then connect the brake module to the track as show in figure 1 of the manual, but do not connect the wire to the signal and the spot after the "emergency section" (you still need a wire from S to the Red in the "emergency stop" section). The trick now is that the brake module should be off when the signal is green. This means you should add a wire from 1 Green to the S (in addition to the wire already connected from S to the Emergency Stop section). DO NOT forget to insulate the center rail as illustrated in Figure 1 of the manual. Insulate the center rail (Red / B) as I illustrate for the stop track here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html&t=1901s BTW - I see not difference between figure 1, 2 or 3 in the manual. Hope this helps! If not try to send me an email and I can send you a drawing. You can find my email here: www.youtube.com/@ModelTrainFun/about Enjoy ;-)
@@ModelTrainFun Hi Bo, Many thanks for your very detailed reply. That is what exactly what I have done, but, there is a problem, when it is Red everything is fine, when it is Green the train runs but both lights Red and Green are ON. Do I have to do some kind of programming in the m84 in order to avoid this? I would like to attach a pdf of my connections that you can have a look, I can I do that? My best regards Mario
@Mario Decca If both Red and Green are on, then double check you have wired exactly as shown here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html Note: This is another video (Beginner Episode 8b). The m84 should be in standard configuration, so reset it (CV8=8). Then you need to use the standard block signal icon for the accessory inside the CS3. As I remember it you need to use "HP0/1" icon under the "Light Signals" tab. Do not use the "HP0/1 Scale" icon. If the signal still shows something wrong - double check if the m84 lights are correct. If wires are correct, perhaps you did not get the m84 reset correctly? ...or did not use the correct icon? Enjoy ;-)
@Mario Decca Did you make it work - I also noticed you were asking to send me a diagram. Please do so using my email - you can find it here: www.youtube.com/@ModelTrainFun/about Enjoy ;-)
So whats the benefits from all this- Wiessman signals are less then the expensive Märklin MFX signals right - But to use 2 of them Wissman you will need 1 dedicated M84 = same cost at the end if you compair with Märklin signas with MFX decoders and plug and play - Did I miss something ?? How ever crazy price for signals
Hi Peo, looking at the prices at my model train shop the savings would be approx. EUR 45 for 2 exit signals with m84 or EUR 49 for 2 entry signals with m84. The other benefit is that you can connect DC power, so you will not have any flickering. Enjoy ;-)
Like the SC3+ - why not a HDMI out - a big schreen today is standard in all aspects - Just to draw a big layout on that small SC3 screen is ridiculously bad
Hi Peo, a screen output would be nice. However, there are other options. You can connect the CS3 to you home network. Then you can connect to your CS3 using any web browser. This means you can connect from your phone, pc, laptop, mac, smart tv and tablet. The web page does not have full functionality - but most. If you want all functionality you can connect from Windows, Mac or Linux and get the same screen directly available. Screen does not become bigger, but much easier using keyboard & mouse. Note: keyboard and mouse can also be connected directly. I usually use the web page for overviews and screen for making events. Enjoy ;-)
So Märklin with all of them bad instructions they have in the German language (If any) They realy not caring about the normal user and people not german spoken - sad story from a proff company like Märklin. Charging sky high prizes for all of their products seems ok - but the customer they dont caree of much - Sad to see
Hi Peo, Märklin actually has a lot of stuff documented in manuals in multiple languages - also in English. All manuals for recent Märklin components are available on their website. I have not been missing anything in the documentation yet. However, when it comes to advanced it can be difficult to figure out and a couple of tries are needed. This video is an example of the flexibility of the m84/m83 components that one would normally not need to do. I do agree that Märklin tend to target German speaking customers when making videos - one of the reasons I made this channel to help Märklinists that don't speak German. The good thing is there is a lot of helpful people in our community that can help ;-)
😀😇🤓🧐Very Great Video. I tried some weeks, to get my Viessmann signals started. Now everythings works fine. You are my new best friend and lifesaver. Hope there are not so much failures in my english.
Greetings from Hannover/ Germany
Ralf
Hi Ralf, I am glad you liked the video and made it work. Hope you have fun with your signals! Enjoy ;-)
Hallo.. just wondering, how many m84 can we connect as an array for a layout.. currently I have 14xm84 and they are flip flop randomly once a loco is running. Thank u
Hi,
I must admit I am not sure what the limit is and the manual does not specify a limit. However, if you see something flip flop randomly something does not sound right... However, this may not be due to the amount of m84s you can connected. It could be that you generally use to much power on your layout.
If you have a CS3 or MS3 try to monitor the power consumption as shown in this video: th-cam.com/video/UuVuEenZn98/w-d-xo.html If you are close to the limit then this might be the issue. To be sure I would recommend to be around 80% of consumption as power consumption changes (e.g. when turnouts/signals change) and the digital signals can be delicate.
It could also be your wirering on the layout. How close to the MS2/CS3 have you taken the power to the m84s? how long is the wire from the MS2/CS3 to the M84. If the m84 gets too far away you could have a degradation in the power and digital signal.
It could also be that the array is too long - try and divide it and see if this changes behaviour.
Do remember that you can connect extra power directly to the m84 as well. I have not tried it, but the manual states "The decoder can also be connected to the 66360/66365 switched mode power pack (only in conjunction with 60822) (here power is not taken from the track and the power demanded from the track is thereby less). ". Check out the manual for the Marklin 60842 (black edition) here: static.maerklin.de/damcontent/46/23/46232662a863dd86dbcd0291ea519cdf1650956214.pdf
Hope this helps! Enjoy ;-)
Very educational. Thank yoo
Glad it was helpful! Enjoy ;-)
Hi Bo, you make very good instruction video's, thanks. I have a question if you could consider the following. I personally have great difficulty in understanding the way the CV system works. e.g. I have (black and white) M84's, In my system, I like to change the brightness of one of the traffic lights. Whatever I do, I cannot get it done. and on top of that I have read that CV 79 is the default, but have no clue on how to activate this. I am looking for a step by step explanation on how to work with CV's, as this will give me a lot of possibilities to work with. At this moment I am to scary to work with it. From your presentation I understand that it is no rocket science. some basic instruction video's on this would be very useful. I would highly appreciate if you would have the time and energy to assist on this.
Rene
Hi Rene,
The CV 79 only exists for the 60842 (the black m84) - not for the 60841 (white m84). If you want to reset the 60841 (white m84) then write 8 in CV8 i.e. CV8=8.
Like you I have not had any success in making the m84 dim (change brightness). To me it makes sense if it cannot do that as the m84 really is a physical relay. The only trickery I have been able to do is to make a light blink. I do this by:
- CV8=8 (Reset)
- CV33=8 (Change to use 8 addresses)
- CV112=2 (set to Blink 2 mode)
- CV114=2 (set to blink every 2 seconds)
The make an accessory for the address of the first output and set to type "Yellow" on the "Light" tab. When you turn on the yellow light, then it will blink every 2 sec. You can make the other outputs blink as well, by choosing one of the pairs (1 Red=CV112/CV114, 1 Green=CV115/CV117, 2Red=CV118/CV120, ..., 4 Green=CV133/CV135)
It seems the blinking only works when you have the m84 configured for 8 addresses - not for 4 addresses.
How did I figure this out? Well, the issue is that Märklin has not documented this too well. Hence, I used trial and error until I found something that works. The m83 manual below can give some hints and the CV template you can load in the CS3 also gives some hints.
There is a CV38 which is specified as brightness of hobby signal. The hobby signal uses the special connector below. I do not have a hobby signal, so I have not tried this.
If you look in the manual for the m83 on page 22: static.maerklin.de/damcontent/3b/44/3b44f7c3c18c5d0a2b0c3e377f3df7281570606458.pdf Then you can see all the functions for the m83. It indicates you can use the m83 as dimmer. However, I have not tried this.
Hope this helps! Enjoy ;-)
Great video thank you.
Is the M83 able to be programmed the same way?
Extensive programming is also possible using the m83. Unfortunately the switch group functionality is not available in the m83. Unsure on how to gain same type of functionality with the m83. I might make a video on this in the future. Enjoy ;-)
Great video, thanks. Can you make a video explaining the connection of the Marklin m84 to a Viessman Block Signal 4011 and the Viessman Digital-Bremsmodul (brake-module) 5232, in order to have trains stopping in front of a red signal keeping sound and lights on and departing at a green signal? Many thanks.
My best regards and congratulations for you videos.
Mario Decca
Hi Mario,
There is a video showing how to connect the Viessmann 4011 to the m84: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html
Unfortunately, I do not have a Viessmann 5232 brake module. If I look in the manual: viessmann-modell.com/media/pdf/a3/fc/9a/5232-pdfr1DUBw5icOLyK.pdf
Look at figure 1 - it shows the "STOP (S)" input as the one controlling if the brake module brakes or not. This is further explained in section 3 where it states 'The digital brake module detects the signal aspect via socket “S” '. In section 4 it states 'If the signal is set to “stop” the module is activated by the lack of track voltage. '
So to me it seems the braking module initiates the brake when no voltage is connected to the "S STOP". This means you should be able to test out the brake module by wiring it up as show in Figure 1 - but without connecting the wire going to the signal and to the spot after the "emergency stop" section (you still need the wire from S to the "emergency STOP" section). In this way when a locomotive arrives it should brake. If this is the case you can try to also connect S to a Red wire of a live track (or to the Red on the track after the "emergency stop" section). Then the locomotive should not break.
If all works as I predict above, then I would suggest you connect the Viessmann 4011 as described in the video under chapter "Track: Connect 4011 home block" - see here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html&t=1293s Then connect the brake module to the track as show in figure 1 of the manual, but do not connect the wire to the signal and the spot after the "emergency section" (you still need a wire from S to the Red in the "emergency stop" section). The trick now is that the brake module should be off when the signal is green. This means you should add a wire from 1 Green to the S (in addition to the wire already connected from S to the Emergency Stop section).
DO NOT forget to insulate the center rail as illustrated in Figure 1 of the manual. Insulate the center rail (Red / B) as I illustrate for the stop track here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html&t=1901s
BTW - I see not difference between figure 1, 2 or 3 in the manual.
Hope this helps! If not try to send me an email and I can send you a drawing. You can find my email here: www.youtube.com/@ModelTrainFun/about
Enjoy ;-)
@@ModelTrainFun Hi Bo, Many thanks for your very detailed reply. That is what exactly what I have done, but, there is a problem, when it is Red everything is fine, when it is Green the train runs but both lights Red and Green are ON. Do I have to do some kind of programming in the m84 in order to avoid this? I would like to attach a pdf of my connections that you can have a look, I can I do that?
My best regards
Mario
@Mario Decca If both Red and Green are on, then double check you have wired exactly as shown here: th-cam.com/video/wrSVwgIgR-4/w-d-xo.html Note: This is another video (Beginner Episode 8b). The m84 should be in standard configuration, so reset it (CV8=8). Then you need to use the standard block signal icon for the accessory inside the CS3. As I remember it you need to use "HP0/1" icon under the "Light Signals" tab. Do not use the "HP0/1 Scale" icon. If the signal still shows something wrong - double check if the m84 lights are correct.
If wires are correct, perhaps you did not get the m84 reset correctly? ...or did not use the correct icon?
Enjoy ;-)
Let me know if it works ;-)
@Mario Decca Did you make it work - I also noticed you were asking to send me a diagram. Please do so using my email - you can find it here: www.youtube.com/@ModelTrainFun/about
Enjoy ;-)
So whats the benefits from all this- Wiessman signals are less then the expensive Märklin MFX signals right - But to use 2 of them Wissman you will need 1 dedicated M84 = same cost at the end if you compair with Märklin signas with MFX decoders and plug and play - Did I miss something ?? How ever crazy price for signals
Hi Peo, looking at the prices at my model train shop the savings would be approx. EUR 45 for 2 exit signals with m84 or EUR 49 for 2 entry signals with m84. The other benefit is that you can connect DC power, so you will not have any flickering. Enjoy ;-)
Like the SC3+ - why not a HDMI out - a big schreen today is standard in all aspects - Just to draw a big layout on that small SC3 screen is
ridiculously bad
Hi Peo, a screen output would be nice. However, there are other options. You can connect the CS3 to you home network. Then you can connect to your CS3 using any web browser. This means you can connect from your phone, pc, laptop, mac, smart tv and tablet. The web page does not have full functionality - but most. If you want all functionality you can connect from Windows, Mac or Linux and get the same screen directly available. Screen does not become bigger, but much easier using keyboard & mouse. Note: keyboard and mouse can also be connected directly. I usually use the web page for overviews and screen for making events. Enjoy ;-)
Hi Peo, A little unsure if keyboard can be directly connected, so it might only be the mouse that can be connected directly? Enjoy ;-)
So Märklin with all of them bad instructions they have in the German language (If any) They realy not caring about the normal user and people not german spoken - sad story from a proff company like Märklin. Charging sky high prizes for all of their products seems ok - but the customer they dont caree of much - Sad to see
Hi Peo, Märklin actually has a lot of stuff documented in manuals in multiple languages - also in English. All manuals for recent Märklin components are available on their website. I have not been missing anything in the documentation yet. However, when it comes to advanced it can be difficult to figure out and a couple of tries are needed. This video is an example of the flexibility of the m84/m83 components that one would normally not need to do. I do agree that Märklin tend to target German speaking customers when making videos - one of the reasons I made this channel to help Märklinists that don't speak German. The good thing is there is a lot of helpful people in our community that can help ;-)