And exo had no plan to increase its frequency, but they did buy new overbuilt trains that would be more appropriate for regional and long distance rail service.
As a Torontonian, I can sympathize with transit projects being greatly scaled-down or canceled because of politics. All I can say is that at least you're getting REM 1.0 and hopefully, the momentum from that can spur more transit development. Toronto is finally turning a corner so maybe Montreal could do a better job at weathering the storm and maybe the REM becomes a revolutionary transit model which changes how governments view transit investment
I think that after the first phase opens, more residents will say "hey, I want that! I'll vote for the candidate who will try to bring it to my neighborhood." Like is happening in Toronto, Ottawa, Vancouver, Québec, and Hamilton
@@PaigeMTL Maybe REM does really great in popular opinion in the next 4 years. REM Est progress. An next election bring promise of a third phase of REM expension.
It will be open in phases. Brossard to Downtown Montreal in 2023. The west island, 2 Mountains and the Airport lines late 2024. Might be still time to connect with the Dorval Via rail station.
Don't forget that they have spent millions by building useless ghost train stations for the Mascouche line, where they don't own the railway and so can't have priority on freight trains, can't build a double railway and can't improve the terrible frequency of that line. ARTM prefer to punish users by forcing them to using the inefficient EXO trains on CN tracks than developing modern transit. They are slow AF, it took YEARS to create a new tarification grid, and it's not even finished. The other thing I don't understand: why the Montreal metro area still have 4 transit agencies (STM/STL/RTL/EXO) when Paris have one metropolitan transit agency and a national railway network working together.
The pandemic has meant that all provincial and federal government employees have basically not worked in over two years. We might be getting 2-3 hours of actual effort per week per government worker these days
I live in the east of Montreal and the REM absolutely need to happen, it will finally make Montreal a WHOLE city rather than a patchwork of town loosely connected to each other. The REM will finally bring prosperity in the east end which has been economically forgotten for years. There are absolute hidden gems in the east end and beautiful natural parks. Parc de la promenade Bellerive is one of the most beautiful park in Montreal with beaches in summer, elder trees and people fishing. Same with Parc du bout de l'île who is just beautiful. People will finally be able to enjoy this part of Montreal. The future of public transport is the REM. Eventually it should extend to Repentigny and do the same on the south and north shore. The Montreal underground subway system with STM was unfortunately designed without any future vision. Building a completely underground subway systems that will never be able to surface made sure the network would never be able to grow because tunneling everywhere is just expensive and complicated. Anyways, the next step for mobility is to allow bicycles in the first and last wagon even in rush hours and also have bike racks on all busses.
It’s imperative for this project to happen. It would be a big betrayal to the east population if it doesn’t go through. The east is already abandoned enough economically and socially. No matter the political affiliation, citizens need to stand united and put pressure on their deputies to push for this project
Allowing bikes on an urban rapid transit system like REM or Métro is usually not a good idea, as much as I want it to be. Commuter rail is a different story in many cases, though. Trains on urban rapid transit lines already spend most of their time pulling into stations, stopping, letting passengers on and off, and accelerating again, while the time spent actually travelling between stations is the minority.... Obviously, having riders lugging their bike onto and off of the train at every stop is going to make that A LOT worse, and slow the train down significantly. And as for bike racks on buses, that works well enough in many cases.... BUT if there are actually a lot of people riding their bike to the bus stop and taking it along with them, it doesn't work, because they can only hold a few bikes... It's a commuting nightmare to ride your bike to the bus stop only to find that there's no room for it and have to ride all way back home, then walk to bus the stop again and wait for the next bus, which in many cases could be quite a while... situations like this can easily double or even triple somebody's door-to-door commute time, and if it happens consistently, get them fired from their job and ruin their finances. But hope is not lost when it comes to integrating bikes and public transit!! The solution is: 1.) A high-quality bike-sharing system in the urban core, unlimited use of which should be included in the price of an unlimited monthly transit pass. 2.) Secure bike storage facilities at all stations outside the bikeshare coverage zone, or preferably at all stations period (but that can sometimes be tricky in the dense, high-land-value urban core). So basically for a typical commuter it would work like this: You ride your personal bike down to the train station, lock it up in the secured storage area, hop on the train and ride into the city, get off the train, and then scan your monthly pass at the station-adjacent bikeshare location, ride to the bikeshare spot nearest to your workplace, return it, and then walk the final block or so to your destination... and then do that in reverse in the evening.
Update: Well as of today may 2nd 2022, the government, mayor Valerie Plante and ARTM officially cancelled the REM de l'est. The government gave in to the not in my backyard crowd. The REM de l'EST will no longer go directly downtown which means that it will be useless since most probably, it will connect to Honoré-Beaugrand or Radisson make it mildly more efficient than a regular bus. Plus having to switch from a highly efficient automated rail line to a inefficient metro system makes the whole project ridiculous. As Mario Dumont said it: if I want a project not to be done, I would give it to the government of Quebec, ville de Montreal and ARTM. This way I'm sure that they will still be taking about in 50 years. Once again, the city of Montreal has shown that it is incapable of putting in place efficient public transport. Quebec is a third world country parading in first world suit. Very sad for the East side of the city. :-(
The Québec government should merge all of the dozens of municipal transit authorities into one for the whole metropolitan Montréal region. Something akin to Translink in BC. One seamless system.
What I appreciate most about this series is that as it delves into increasingly esoteric and policy wonk territory the editing just gets that much more epic.
Attacking the uncertainty of COVID and WFH by pointing out how the REM’s design attracts non-commuting trips is very astute. Also, the way you framed the redesign of the buses as an opportunity (with the lovely animations) was very well done.
The Berri area is really… “spicy”. Instead of a tunnel link (not a bad idea but comes with its sets of challenge), they could revamp the segment of Saint-Hubert and Sainte-Catherine, make those segment shared street, maybe add a canopy from the stm station to the rem station, add a lot of lighting, plants, and cameras.
This is a great video, and it really explains how amazing REM East could be. My only suggestion is for all your REM related videos, to have “Montreal REM” somewhere in the title so that the algorithm will show it to people and those people will click on it knowing that it’s about this “controversial” megaproject. We want as many people as possible to see this. So, after all this, is it happening? Or is it likely to be cancelled.
Well as of August 2023, REM 1.0 is open. Rem de l'est has been renamed Projet Structurant de l'Est (PSE) and taken over by the ARTM, aka one of the whining agencies upset they weren't invited to the party. They've eliminated the downtown connection down Rene Lévesque, want to bury the North and East sections in a tunnel, and now the line costs $36 Billion and maaayyyyyybe can extend into Laval. Looks like the STM is getting their wish by having everyone funneled into Assomption at the least
Great animations! The REM de l'Est will cross the Blue Line extension at Lacordaire and Jean-Talon. It will also connect to the Pie-IX SRB at Pie-IX and Notre-Dame. The Blue Line will also connect to the Pie-IX SRB at Jean-Talon and Pie-IX. The REM de l'Est will connect to the Mascouche commuter train line at their Pointe-Aux-Trembles terminus.
As of Early May, Caisse has been entirely shut out of the design and development of REM de l'est by the Mayor of Montreal with the backing of NIMBYs and related agencies, leaving the entire network of jeopardy and is likely not to ever be built now, much to the detriment of everyone in the region whom needed this transit project. Politics and bureaucracy has once again curbed any hope for the development of a comprehensive rapid public transit system for Montreal. This will not impact the current REM, but will likely heavily influence future expansions, such as on the South Shore or expansions of de l'est towards the Airport, among other expansions.
ARTM and STM thought attacking the REM was the most pressing and appropriate thing to do even though they have their own organizational issues and sketchy practices 💅
I love how you dive deep and cover the more political aspects of urban and transit planning!! Im aware of the political battles around transit in Toronto but this made me learn a lot about Montreal’s politicization of transit. Loved your amazing maps and animations too!!
Paige is committed to doing a video in French at 100 Patrons. He's nearly there. Lets get him over the mark. What a great series this latest one is Paige! So much work and very high quality.
Vienna is being its first automat line U5 and Wienerlien is going well with the change. They will still have operators but the city is willing to pay for that to make transit better.
One interesting technical detail is that the Montreal Metro is a largely automated system. The drivers usually just operate the doors and press the button to start the train moving. Everything in between is done by a central computer. It would be theoretically possible to go driverless by adding platform screen doors at the stations and updating the signaling.
You just talking about the hypothetical commutes and how efficient they'll be made me so excited! I really, really hope it happens!!! Couldn't help laughing when you mentioned the pink line though...
incredible content as always!! You are my best source of information about montreal. Informative, well researched, fun, nice visuals... a hidden pearl!!!
Exactly for the population in the east and north of montreal. If this project doesn’t go through it would be a big let down and betrayal by deputies from both liberal and CAQ parties. It won’t matter then what political affiliations people have. This project must happen, the east and north are undeservedly less reachable with transportation and this project is the way to revive the boroughs and lift them from economical and social poverty
@@belmehdilyes7059 I agree. It’s not be we’ll explained that this is essentially a development project which will allow a significant increase in homes to be built that will be very positive for the whole Montreal region. People are shortsighted, the press is shortsighted.
That's the whole series for now. Packaged it into a playlist if you've missed some of it: th-cam.com/play/PLTNrJFli7ocidy3uycqrUXNvskqLcF4xb.html Latest news: th-cam.com/video/1zaYE0W0pyk/w-d-xo.html
On another note, the South shore bus change has led to services running to the REM every 30mins Monday to Friday. It takes less than 30mins to drive to Montréal 🤦
What area of the South shore? For the most part, exo and RTL are extending coverage, frequency, new suburb to suburb lines, and improving all-day and all-week service.
@@rbejva yeah, Longueil and Brossard are going to have the best improvements. Unless St-Cath, Candiac, La Prairie, etc. are willing to build mixed and densely fast along stroads like Taschereau, there just so much exo and the RTL can do. Like they can't fix the bad urbanism of La Magdeleine. Change is going to be incremental.
Hot take: Since REM l'Est is entirely on the island, maybe the STM, with help from CDPQ, should be building it? The STM would still get ridership all while providing fast, convenient service into downtown, and then the ARTM, with help from CDPQ, should be working together to upgrade the Mascouche line so it can provide the Northern Suburbs, like Ahuntsic and Saint-Michel with fast, reliable service to downtown.
For Americans confused about the use of the term "liberal" just replace that word in your mind with the word "conservative" colloquially. Liberal means something different to Americans than it does to the rest of the world.
Amazing video, different companies competing over who can build transit reminds me of London over a century ago (I know these are government-owned companies but still)
Nice video, I hope to use the REM l'est before 2030. It will be clear example of a modern efficient transit that helps cities to prosper and improve quality of live its citizens, same as the original REM project that will start working this year in the same city...
I find it galling that a transport lobby keeps comparing Melbourne to Montreal and finding Melbourne wanting. I understand that Montreal is half the size of Melbourne. Like apples to oranges.
Developments that go up after the announcement of a transit line should be able to sue the government based on reduction or cancellation of service. I know that's stupid and I have no idea of the implications but I don't care. There should be an immediate visible cost to attacking transit plans.
I don't care what "network" arguments you being up, building a new line along the green line is pointless (like Mirabel). Build the REM on the route of the blue line and close the latter. It will bring PAT closer to downtown, but not along the green line, practically guaranteeing its bankruptcy in the east.
Back in a previous video when you mentioned that the project's name was "REM l'Est", it struck me as odd but I took your word for it. This video, while you called it "REM l'Est" you showed an article confirming that it's actually "REM _de_ l'Est". You might want to fix that going forward since people are going to be referring to your videos a lot when referring to the project since you've you've covered it so extensively.
The ARTM aren't the only organisation which are insecure. CDPQ can't be bothered to make a proper transfer station because they want users to stay on their system. That is my interpretation of the placement of the Labelle station and the poor connectivity that will result from that choice. To be fair to the ARTM, if they are like the STS, the ones making the decisions probably don't use transit. It is no wonder that they don't seem to be able to get results.
enalung?! Is that you? Hiiiii 😃 Anyway, it’s more likely that in those cases CDPQ chose the most simple, fast, and affordable solutions to open their lines as soon as possible. Transfer quality is more a consequence of that rather than it being designed-in to keep passengers longer. On the flip side, the STM chose blue line station location to accommodate their bus network, rather than rework their bus network around the new stations, and went with expensive expropriations, multiple and large stations entrances, instead of downscaling and building on public property. Both approaches come with their own set of issues and advantages, but there’s hardly anything insecure about it.
Now that the all users of REM North and East branches will have to connect to rest of the network at Assumption (well outside the downtown core) on the already crowded and sub-par frequency Green Line (the infrastructure can support a maximal frequency of 3 minutes, right now it's 5 minutes) they'll have to find the money to increase Green Line capacity, which I guess they should do anyway, but I wonder the effects of having a network that could have brought people all the way downtoen and easilu access Orange and Green versus all their traffic being funnelled onto the Green Line at Assumption. Plus the REM would have been running at speeds a good deal faster getting people downtown than the Green Line which runs slow. P.S. Also, can anyone explain to me how and why a station was built on Île Bigras for the current REM? The island has around 150 buildings on it, is connected only to Ile Jesus/Laval by a single short bridge, and is a 10 minute walk from the Sainte Dorothée Station a kilometre away on Laval. Normally the more stations the better but this just seems crazy. Again, an *island* with a *150* or so homes which is only conmected to one other landmass, and a *10 minute walk* to the current exo and future REM station on said landmass. No one but the 150 or so households on the island will use it (and the 50 or so homes on Ile Verte which is only connected to Bigras and nothing else), no one in Laval will use it (even at the closest point between Laval and Bigras it would be quicker to just walk or drive to the Saint Dorothee station on Laval), Ile Bigras isn't connect by road or walking bridge to the Ile Bizzard or Ile Montreal (so it's not as if people in either of those nearby areas of those islands can access the station). Also, the island is very small so it's not as if "Well there's only a couple dozen homes there now but think of what a new station could bring". (Yes I get it, it's not all about core-periphery pendular traffic, but it's still an important facet).
I don't have any secret information but I suspect that the Île Bigras station was the result of a very simple decision by CDPQ at the very beginning of the project. - If it had an EXO station then it got a REM station to smooth the way for approval of the project. You could ask a similar question about why weren't the Grand Moulin and Ste-Dorothée stations merged into a single station? The Île-Bigras station will definately be the least-used station on the entire network. No densification will occur on Île-Bigras because of NIMBYs and the fact that the entire island is in a flood zone.
Using CDPQ to overtake ARTM should be more concerning and ring a bell as there's something fishy going on and we're getting played. Remember McGill and Edouard-Montpetit transfers weren't part of the plan, this should raise concerns on their abilities and real motivations. It's not because CDPQ is good at managing a project that they are good urban planners, this is not the place for overreaching and complacy, can't possibly overlook this like it's normal. If they were honnest they would work first thing with urban planners and not want full control and blackmail any opposition.
There's no takeover or blackmailing, that's your headcanon; there's a conservative and complacent organization lashing out because it doesn't like CDPQ parameters and how it forces them to evaluate their own way of doing things. The AMT didn't have any intentions to connect the DM line to McGill or ED for the foreseeable future, and CDPQ promptly added those transfer stations, so it's not the takedown you think it is. Speaking of good urban planning, it's fishy that ARTM pushes for expensive expropriations and giant free park-and-ride, or doesn't bring into question STM being lock-in into rubber tire metro or refusal to move towards full automation, or doesn't challenge municipalities for their lacking planning around transit stations. The ARTM doesn't have the most sound urban planning practices, they've have been called out for it, but now they're suddenly champions of urban planning? If the opposition were honest they'd admit it's really about fearing change and keeping the status quo, rather than improving the lives and transit options of Montrealers.
@@MG-mo7ib Well you certainly point out concerns that should be adressed, but if you read correct i'm toward cooperation between parties in regard of their supposed roles and mandates, in contradiction with the actual division, made up and amplified for god knows reasons (and it's a dead trap). ARTM is a provincial creation "that manages and integrates road transport and public transport in Greater Montreal" while CDPQi is another provincial creation "dedicated to the development of infrastructures and their management". I'm far from defending any party here but rather taxpayer's money and accountability, if ARTM fails to accomplish their tasks that's one thing that needs to be adressed and not to rot, not doing it and give a free pass to CDPQi to fulfill the job should undeniably be concerning, and we'd be fools to imagine it's all for our good.
The more videos you make, the more I want CDPQ Infra to stick it to the ARTM lol... It's funny how their "analysis" of the REM de l'Est is so biased when the solution(s) are right in front of their faces. So unfortunate that these corps in charge are stuck in such an old mentality. Keep up the great work on the vids!!
Your point that ARTM and STM are salty are correct. But you dismiss the concerns around privatisation far too quickly. It is not the "establishment" railing against privatisation. It is the establishment and the political elites which are pushing privatisation. Handing over planning, ownership, and control of massive public infrastructure to an undemocractic for-profit entity is not a good idea.
This private company you're fearing is in fact a State-owned pension fund. CDPQ is literally owned by the government and the profits go directly into taxpayers' pockets.
@@Jessyjames24 it being owned by the state doesn’t stop making it a for-profit institution. It is privatisation because the elected institutions do not have control over the system. An unaccountable for-profit institution is in-charge. The profit-motive does not go away.
@@MG-mo7ib i’m one of those who thinks the public should control the infrastructure, and the infrastructure should first and foremost serve its purpose. Profit-motive increases the chance of the project deviating from that purpose. A pension fund, even publicly-owned, has a profit-motive. A pension fund is also less accountable to the public because it is an arms-length away from the elected govt. The Caisse’s interest is making a profit out of the REM. Their interest is not serving the transport needs of Montrealers as effectively as possible.
I understand your point but stopping at Honoré-Beaugrand would save a few millions per kilometres and bring the north arm of REM to Pie-IX station would cost a lot less and it’s us tax payers who will pay the bill at the end. On the other hand, I’m living on the north shore near Deux-Montagnes and REM de l’Est is far from me. Although I’m a native from Tétraultville and quite frankly using the train track between Souligny and DuBuisson streets is far fetch. Getting in by George V boulevard but getting out by which street? Honoré-Beaugrand street isn’t large enough, other streets like DesOrmeaux, Pierre-Bernard or Lebrun are way too narrow to go back to Sherbrooke so last alternative would be by the Highway 25 but then last stop would be Radisson which doesn’t make sense at all. What would make much more sense would be start by Sherbrooke street at the east tip of the island (for Repentigny users) and follow Sherbrooke street all the way at ground level up to Georges V where it goes above ground a bit like the west arm of REM (1) and stop at H.Beaugrand to prevent doubling services and raise the frequency of the green line to a train every 3 minutes (to allow the preceding train to arrive at the next station) and this wouldn’t be 70 minutes to get to McGill like you say but more like 50 minutes to get from east end to McGill. Even if it takes 70 minutes, it’s a major improvement then take a car from Pointe-aux-Trembles to downtown which can take more than an hour with traffic. And you know I’m not saying this to piss you off but to be logic and cost effective because you know just like me that REM (1) won’t cost 7 billions $ like CDPQ said but more like 9 or 10 billions $ like most government driven projects are. They will use COVID excuse or work delay to justify the overboard cost it generates. How many times did they delay the launch of the south branch up to now 3 or 4 times how much those delays cost…. That’s why I’m saying to stay cost effective because REM de l’Est will cost more that 10 billions $ to get downtown and it still us tax payers that pays the cost at the end.
th-cam.com/video/vKAl6DOcASc/w-d-xo.html World class transit systems are reliable and fast. A single line with technology that travels at half the speed is neither fast or reliable.
The best transit is the transit we build. There will always be people to find issues with a project. I'm so glad Quebec are finally getting their tram. A metro on the tramway alignement, trams where the feeder brt were planned and investment in regional rail would have better, but there's no way I'd condone sabotaging the Quebec Tramway project because it's not "the best".
@@MG-mo7ib so should the ARTM simply be abolished? Simply accept whatever project the provincial government decides it wants to fund? I'm not suggesting the REM be cancelled, but we should not be so dismissive when a planning body actually tries to plan
@@ramsaymayka9978 But that's the thing though, the ARTM hasn't put much work into planning since its inception. Their last PSD is a mess. The ARTM should strive to be more like CDPQi instead of undermining them. A state corporation with it's own streams of revenu, a functional independence from local mayors, provincial ministers, and isn't bogged down by every interest group and years of consultation circuits. They should also move away from car-centric practices like planning 1000+ place of free park-and-ride for a station, or going to court to expropriate land.... to build parkings bigger than stations. The ARTM hasn't had the best practices . Maybe that's a cultural legacy from the AMT, that also bleed into the STM and other agencies. Instead of reflecting on their own internal problems, they've lashed out at the new operator and asked for more money... not for an alternative project in particular, but to keep the bureaucratic machine working. That's not a very pro-transit user mindset.
I understand that there's a narrative in the video, but you're pushing it without acknowledging the issues of the projects and it makes you sound like you're doing an ad. I usually love your work, and the video is of good quality, but this topic deserves much more nuance than you gave it
The video (and the rest of the series) overtly acknowledges the issues of the project, and actually brings much of the nuance missing from the discourse on the project. Your comment make it sound like you’ve been really selective with what you’ve heard and just hurried to write your take.
@@TD-gc5tq On the contrary, I follow the project quite actively. I think the tone of his video is more about making fun of the opposition of the REM 2 by completely dismissing their points in a ridiculing way. The reality is somewhere in the middle, and it's frustrating how he's not acknowledging that in this specific video
@@williamdion1236 maybe, but at some point that just becomes about sustaining a false balance. Say he sees the ARTM methodology and conclusions as substandard and dubious, how indulgent does he have to be when talking about it?
My favorite part was how the ARTM was afraid of how the REM de l'est would affect their 8 round trip, 5 days a week Mascouche line.
And exo had no plan to increase its frequency, but they did buy new overbuilt trains that would be more appropriate for regional and long distance rail service.
Now that is a white elephant that should have been a better Commuter train line with better service instead of rush hour only.
If that northern branch touches the Mascouche line, would make it more convenient!
ARTM is a nuissance. They never did anything and they are the only thing to blame for the stagnation of Mass transit in Montreal Area for decade.
As a Torontonian, I can sympathize with transit projects being greatly scaled-down or canceled because of politics. All I can say is that at least you're getting REM 1.0 and hopefully, the momentum from that can spur more transit development. Toronto is finally turning a corner so maybe Montreal could do a better job at weathering the storm and maybe the REM becomes a revolutionary transit model which changes how governments view transit investment
I think that after the first phase opens, more residents will say "hey, I want that! I'll vote for the candidate who will try to bring it to my neighborhood." Like is happening in Toronto, Ottawa, Vancouver, Québec, and Hamilton
@@jonb3286 It will probably open just after the provincial election
@@PaigeMTL Maybe REM does really great in popular opinion in the next 4 years. REM Est progress. An next election bring promise of a third phase of REM expension.
We can only hope, advocate and organize
It will be open in phases. Brossard to Downtown Montreal in 2023. The west island, 2 Mountains and the Airport lines late 2024. Might be still time to connect with the Dorval Via rail station.
Don't forget that they have spent millions by building useless ghost train stations for the Mascouche line, where they don't own the railway and so can't have priority on freight trains, can't build a double railway and can't improve the terrible frequency of that line. ARTM prefer to punish users by forcing them to using the inefficient EXO trains on CN tracks than developing modern transit. They are slow AF, it took YEARS to create a new tarification grid, and it's not even finished. The other thing I don't understand: why the Montreal metro area still have 4 transit agencies (STM/STL/RTL/EXO) when Paris have one metropolitan transit agency and a national railway network working together.
Maybe the ARTM should take notes from Metrolinx and make EXO much more similar to GO RER in the GTHA
This would make sense if the ARTM would take notes both on the Mascouche line and the West Island line. Better service on both is needed.
"It's the pandemic, we couldn't find the envelopes"
The pandemic has meant that all provincial and federal government employees have basically not worked in over two years. We might be getting 2-3 hours of actual effort per week per government worker these days
I live in the east of Montreal and the REM absolutely need to happen, it will finally make Montreal a WHOLE city rather than a patchwork of town loosely connected to each other. The REM will finally bring prosperity in the east end which has been economically forgotten for years. There are absolute hidden gems in the east end and beautiful natural parks. Parc de la promenade Bellerive is one of the most beautiful park in Montreal with beaches in summer, elder trees and people fishing. Same with Parc du bout de l'île who is just beautiful. People will finally be able to enjoy this part of Montreal. The future of public transport is the REM. Eventually it should extend to Repentigny and do the same on the south and north shore. The Montreal underground subway system with STM was unfortunately designed without any future vision. Building a completely underground subway systems that will never be able to surface made sure the network would never be able to grow because tunneling everywhere is just expensive and complicated. Anyways, the next step for mobility is to allow bicycles in the first and last wagon even in rush hours and also have bike racks on all busses.
It’s imperative for this project to happen. It would be a big betrayal to the east population if it doesn’t go through. The east is already abandoned enough economically and socially. No matter the political affiliation, citizens need to stand united and put pressure on their deputies to push for this project
Allowing bikes on an urban rapid transit system like REM or Métro is usually not a good idea, as much as I want it to be. Commuter rail is a different story in many cases, though.
Trains on urban rapid transit lines already spend most of their time pulling into stations, stopping, letting passengers on and off, and accelerating again, while the time spent actually travelling between stations is the minority....
Obviously, having riders lugging their bike onto and off of the train at every stop is going to make that A LOT worse, and slow the train down significantly.
And as for bike racks on buses, that works well enough in many cases.... BUT if there are actually a lot of people riding their bike to the bus stop and taking it along with them, it doesn't work, because they can only hold a few bikes...
It's a commuting nightmare to ride your bike to the bus stop only to find that there's no room for it and have to ride all way back home, then walk to bus the stop again and wait for the next bus, which in many cases could be quite a while... situations like this can easily double or even triple somebody's door-to-door commute time, and if it happens consistently, get them fired from their job and ruin their finances.
But hope is not lost when it comes to integrating bikes and public transit!!
The solution is:
1.) A high-quality bike-sharing system in the urban core, unlimited use of which should be included in the price of an unlimited monthly transit pass.
2.) Secure bike storage facilities at all stations outside the bikeshare coverage zone, or preferably at all stations period (but that can sometimes be tricky in the dense, high-land-value urban core).
So basically for a typical commuter it would work like this: You ride your personal bike down to the train station, lock it up in the secured storage area, hop on the train and ride into the city, get off the train, and then scan your monthly pass at the station-adjacent bikeshare location, ride to the bikeshare spot nearest to your workplace, return it, and then walk the final block or so to your destination... and then do that in reverse in the evening.
@@dootyminnozezelochi2257 thanks for your thorough reply!
As a parent bike commuter, secure storage was a definite must.
Update: Well as of today may 2nd 2022, the government, mayor Valerie Plante and ARTM officially cancelled the REM de l'est. The government gave in to the not in my backyard crowd. The REM de l'EST will no longer go directly downtown which means that it will be useless since most probably, it will connect to Honoré-Beaugrand or Radisson make it mildly more efficient than a regular bus. Plus having to switch from a highly efficient automated rail line to a inefficient metro system makes the whole project ridiculous. As Mario Dumont said it: if I want a project not to be done, I would give it to the government of Quebec, ville de Montreal and ARTM. This way I'm sure that they will still be taking about in 50 years. Once again, the city of Montreal has shown that it is incapable of putting in place efficient public transport. Quebec is a third world country parading in first world suit. Very sad for the East side of the city. :-(
Funny thing is that a few years ago, the STM was attacking the ARTM in the same way. Is it corporate warfare when the corporations are state owned?
The Québec government should merge all of the dozens of municipal transit authorities into one for the whole metropolitan Montréal region. Something akin to Translink in BC. One seamless system.
What I appreciate most about this series is that as it delves into increasingly esoteric and policy wonk territory the editing just gets that much more epic.
Attacking the uncertainty of COVID and WFH by pointing out how the REM’s design attracts non-commuting trips is very astute. Also, the way you framed the redesign of the buses as an opportunity (with the lovely animations) was very well done.
The Berri area is really… “spicy”. Instead of a tunnel link (not a bad idea but comes with its sets of challenge), they could revamp the segment of Saint-Hubert and Sainte-Catherine, make those segment shared street, maybe add a canopy from the stm station to the rem station, add a lot of lighting, plants, and cameras.
This is a great video, and it really explains how amazing REM East could be. My only suggestion is for all your REM related videos, to have “Montreal REM” somewhere in the title so that the algorithm will show it to people and those people will click on it knowing that it’s about this “controversial” megaproject. We want as many people as possible to see this.
So, after all this, is it happening? Or is it likely to be cancelled.
Well as of August 2023, REM 1.0 is open. Rem de l'est has been renamed Projet Structurant de l'Est (PSE) and taken over by the ARTM, aka one of the whining agencies upset they weren't invited to the party. They've eliminated the downtown connection down Rene Lévesque, want to bury the North and East sections in a tunnel, and now the line costs $36 Billion and maaayyyyyybe can extend into Laval. Looks like the STM is getting their wish by having everyone funneled into Assomption at the least
Too many transit agencies... They need to be streamlined to say the least...
The government of Ontario had the good idea when they created Metrolinx to do just that in the GTHA
Great animations! The REM de l'Est will cross the Blue Line extension at Lacordaire and Jean-Talon. It will also connect to the Pie-IX SRB at Pie-IX and Notre-Dame. The Blue Line will also connect to the Pie-IX SRB at Jean-Talon and Pie-IX. The REM de l'Est will connect to the Mascouche commuter train line at their Pointe-Aux-Trembles terminus.
The ARTM will benefit from the REM: the REM will induce ridership from trips never thought of before and probably involve interchange with metro.
A nurse leaving home at 8:10AM? Must be working an afternoon shift!!
Great video, that just stood out as hilarious
As of Early May, Caisse has been entirely shut out of the design and development of REM de l'est by the Mayor of Montreal with the backing of NIMBYs and related agencies, leaving the entire network of jeopardy and is likely not to ever be built now, much to the detriment of everyone in the region whom needed this transit project. Politics and bureaucracy has once again curbed any hope for the development of a comprehensive rapid public transit system for Montreal. This will not impact the current REM, but will likely heavily influence future expansions, such as on the South Shore or expansions of de l'est towards the Airport, among other expansions.
28 day wait was worth it!
ARTM and STM thought attacking the REM was the most pressing and appropriate thing to do even though they have their own organizational issues and sketchy practices 💅
I love how you dive deep and cover the more political aspects of urban and transit planning!! Im aware of the political battles around transit in Toronto but this made me learn a lot about Montreal’s politicization of transit. Loved your amazing maps and animations too!!
I really don't know how you don't have more viewers. Your videos are beautifully made!
I'm guessing not everyone is going to find them.
Paige is committed to doing a video in French at 100 Patrons. He's nearly there. Lets get him over the mark. What a great series this latest one is Paige! So much work and very high quality.
Nous avons confiance en Paige!
Vienna is being its first automat line U5 and Wienerlien is going well with the change. They will still have operators but the city is willing to pay for that to make transit better.
Great video! Love the transit animations!
One interesting technical detail is that the Montreal Metro is a largely automated system. The drivers usually just operate the doors and press the button to start the train moving. Everything in between is done by a central computer. It would be theoretically possible to go driverless by adding platform screen doors at the stations and updating the signaling.
Only have plans to add CBTC on blue line that would make it possible to automate everything so highly doubt that's happening anytime soon
STM have stated that they do not intend to move towards full automation, even after they upgrade the system and install platform screen doors.
Indeed I think it was one of the first computerized metro systems in the world back in the 70s.
Major curve ball thrown yesterday by Frank & Val. I wonder if we'll get a bonus video as a result?
Well put. Now we need a French version of this video that I can pass on to my NIMBY neighbours opposing the REM l’Est.
You just talking about the hypothetical commutes and how efficient they'll be made me so excited! I really, really hope it happens!!!
Couldn't help laughing when you mentioned the pink line though...
*The Pink solution*
I hate nimbys. We were so close to such a good system. Ugh
incredible content as always!! You are my best source of information about montreal. Informative, well researched, fun, nice visuals... a hidden pearl!!!
Great video!
One thing to note, CAQ ridings are impacted by the REM even if it doesn’t pass through. Eg La Prairie, Chambly.
All the major political parties groups are impacted, thats part of why its such a brilliant project proposal
Exactly for the population in the east and north of montreal. If this project doesn’t go through it would be a big let down and betrayal by deputies from both liberal and CAQ parties. It won’t matter then what political affiliations people have. This project must happen, the east and north are undeservedly less reachable with transportation and this project is the way to revive the boroughs and lift them from economical and social poverty
@@belmehdilyes7059 I agree. It’s not be we’ll explained that this is essentially a development project which will allow a significant increase in homes to be built that will be very positive for the whole Montreal region.
People are shortsighted, the press is shortsighted.
That's the whole series for now.
Packaged it into a playlist if you've missed some of it: th-cam.com/play/PLTNrJFli7ocidy3uycqrUXNvskqLcF4xb.html
Latest news: th-cam.com/video/1zaYE0W0pyk/w-d-xo.html
Excellent work Paige! You are constantly improving as a storyteller and this series will move many to think afresh.
you might want to pin this post. Thanks for the series!
God Paige I love your videos so much!!! This series on the REM is so fantastic
On another note, the South shore bus change has led to services running to the REM every 30mins Monday to Friday. It takes less than 30mins to drive to Montréal 🤦
What area of the South shore? For the most part, exo and RTL are extending coverage, frequency, new suburb to suburb lines, and improving all-day and all-week service.
@@MG-mo7ib La Prairie.
@@rbejva yeah, Longueil and Brossard are going to have the best improvements. Unless St-Cath, Candiac, La Prairie, etc. are willing to build mixed and densely fast along stroads like Taschereau, there just so much exo and the RTL can do. Like they can't fix the bad urbanism of La Magdeleine. Change is going to be incremental.
Hot take: Since REM l'Est is entirely on the island, maybe the STM, with help from CDPQ, should be building it? The STM would still get ridership all while providing fast, convenient service into downtown, and then the ARTM, with help from CDPQ, should be working together to upgrade the Mascouche line so it can provide the Northern Suburbs, like Ahuntsic and Saint-Michel with fast, reliable service to downtown.
For Americans confused about the use of the term "liberal" just replace that word in your mind with the word "conservative" colloquially. Liberal means something different to Americans than it does to the rest of the world.
Amazing video, different companies competing over who can build transit reminds me of London over a century ago (I know these are government-owned companies but still)
Nice video, I hope to use the REM l'est before 2030. It will be clear example of a modern efficient transit that helps cities to prosper and improve quality of live its citizens, same as the original REM project that will start working this year in the same city...
I find it galling that a transport lobby keeps comparing Melbourne to Montreal and finding Melbourne wanting. I understand that Montreal is half the size of Melbourne. Like apples to oranges.
Developments that go up after the announcement of a transit line should be able to sue the government based on reduction or cancellation of service.
I know that's stupid and I have no idea of the implications but I don't care. There should be an immediate visible cost to attacking transit plans.
I don't care what "network" arguments you being up, building a new line along the green line is pointless (like Mirabel).
Build the REM on the route of the blue line and close the latter. It will bring PAT closer to downtown, but not along the green line, practically guaranteeing its bankruptcy in the east.
Awsome paige great research
There he is
Back in a previous video when you mentioned that the project's name was "REM l'Est", it struck me as odd but I took your word for it. This video, while you called it "REM l'Est" you showed an article confirming that it's actually "REM _de_ l'Est". You might want to fix that going forward since people are going to be referring to your videos a lot when referring to the project since you've you've covered it so extensively.
The ARTM aren't the only organisation which are insecure. CDPQ can't be bothered to make a proper transfer station because they want users to stay on their system. That is my interpretation of the placement of the Labelle station and the poor connectivity that will result from that choice.
To be fair to the ARTM, if they are like the STS, the ones making the decisions probably don't use transit. It is no wonder that they don't seem to be able to get results.
enalung?! Is that you? Hiiiii 😃 Anyway, it’s more likely that in those cases CDPQ chose the most simple, fast, and affordable solutions to open their lines as soon as possible. Transfer quality is more a consequence of that rather than it being designed-in to keep passengers longer. On the flip side, the STM chose blue line station location to accommodate their bus network, rather than rework their bus network around the new stations, and went with expensive expropriations, multiple and large stations entrances, instead of downscaling and building on public property. Both approaches come with their own set of issues and advantages, but there’s hardly anything insecure about it.
7:45 XD using a trash bin for Laval :DDD
may someone explain to me beside car focused infrastructure, why is laval getting hated on :D
Laval is the suburb people who can't afford to move to the south shore move to
/sigh this entire country's transit planning process.
Omg what's going to happen to the project now? Could you please do a video on the CDPQ's withdrawal?
Canadian Civil: th-cam.com/video/1zaYE0W0pyk/w-d-xo.html
Obsessed with this REM series. I go to RMtransit for more technical details and to you for political context 😂😂
Now that the all users of REM North and East branches will have to connect to rest of the network at Assumption (well outside the downtown core) on the already crowded and sub-par frequency Green Line (the infrastructure can support a maximal frequency of 3 minutes, right now it's 5 minutes) they'll have to find the money to increase Green Line capacity, which I guess they should do anyway, but I wonder the effects of having a network that could have brought people all the way downtoen and easilu access Orange and Green versus all their traffic being funnelled onto the Green Line at Assumption. Plus the REM would have been running at speeds a good deal faster getting people downtown than the Green Line which runs slow.
P.S. Also, can anyone explain to me how and why a station was built on Île Bigras for the current REM? The island has around 150 buildings on it, is connected only to Ile Jesus/Laval by a single short bridge, and is a 10 minute walk from the Sainte Dorothée Station a kilometre away on Laval. Normally the more stations the better but this just seems crazy. Again, an *island* with a *150* or so homes which is only conmected to one other landmass, and a *10 minute walk* to the current exo and future REM station on said landmass. No one but the 150 or so households on the island will use it (and the 50 or so homes on Ile Verte which is only connected to Bigras and nothing else), no one in Laval will use it (even at the closest point between Laval and Bigras it would be quicker to just walk or drive to the Saint Dorothee station on Laval), Ile Bigras isn't connect by road or walking bridge to the Ile Bizzard or Ile Montreal (so it's not as if people in either of those nearby areas of those islands can access the station). Also, the island is very small so it's not as if "Well there's only a couple dozen homes there now but think of what a new station could bring". (Yes I get it, it's not all about core-periphery pendular traffic, but it's still an important facet).
I don't have any secret information but I suspect that the Île Bigras station was the result of a very simple decision by CDPQ at the very beginning of the project.
- If it had an EXO station then it got a REM station to smooth the way for approval of the project.
You could ask a similar question about why weren't the Grand Moulin and Ste-Dorothée stations merged into a single station?
The Île-Bigras station will definately be the least-used station on the entire network. No densification will occur on Île-Bigras because of NIMBYs and the fact that the entire island is in a flood zone.
And with the way things are going they should retrain all train drivers as transit police...
As an American, I burst out laughing that Hawaii's now 10 year late HART line was being used as a positive example for once
Better late than never.
over budget and late as heck, but it's here at least.
Using CDPQ to overtake ARTM should be more concerning and ring a bell as there's something fishy going on and we're getting played. Remember McGill and Edouard-Montpetit transfers weren't part of the plan, this should raise concerns on their abilities and real motivations.
It's not because CDPQ is good at managing a project that they are good urban planners, this is not the place for overreaching and complacy, can't possibly overlook this like it's normal.
If they were honnest they would work first thing with urban planners and not want full control and blackmail any opposition.
There's no takeover or blackmailing, that's your headcanon; there's a conservative and complacent organization lashing out because it doesn't like CDPQ parameters and how it forces them to evaluate their own way of doing things. The AMT didn't have any intentions to connect the DM line to McGill or ED for the foreseeable future, and CDPQ promptly added those transfer stations, so it's not the takedown you think it is.
Speaking of good urban planning, it's fishy that ARTM pushes for expensive expropriations and giant free park-and-ride, or doesn't bring into question STM being lock-in into rubber tire metro or refusal to move towards full automation, or doesn't challenge municipalities for their lacking planning around transit stations. The ARTM doesn't have the most sound urban planning practices, they've have been called out for it, but now they're suddenly champions of urban planning?
If the opposition were honest they'd admit it's really about fearing change and keeping the status quo, rather than improving the lives and transit options of Montrealers.
@@MG-mo7ib Well you certainly point out concerns that should be adressed, but if you read correct i'm toward cooperation between parties in regard of their supposed roles and mandates, in contradiction with the actual division, made up and amplified for god knows reasons (and it's a dead trap). ARTM is a provincial creation "that manages and integrates road transport and public transport in Greater Montreal" while CDPQi is another provincial creation "dedicated to the development of infrastructures and their management".
I'm far from defending any party here but rather taxpayer's money and accountability, if ARTM fails to accomplish their tasks that's one thing that needs to be adressed and not to rot, not doing it and give a free pass to CDPQi to fulfill the job should undeniably be concerning, and we'd be fools to imagine it's all for our good.
Figures that they would use out of date statistics for the ARTM papers.
The whole mandate of the ARTM is to help plan transit in the region, so not including them in the planning is kind of a big deal.
They were so focused on taking years figuring out fare integration and collection, it just seemed rude to bother them with actual transit planning.
The more videos you make, the more I want CDPQ Infra to stick it to the ARTM lol... It's funny how their "analysis" of the REM de l'Est is so biased when the solution(s) are right in front of their faces. So unfortunate that these corps in charge are stuck in such an old mentality. Keep up the great work on the vids!!
Your point that ARTM and STM are salty are correct. But you dismiss the concerns around privatisation far too quickly. It is not the "establishment" railing against privatisation. It is the establishment and the political elites which are pushing privatisation. Handing over planning, ownership, and control of massive public infrastructure to an undemocractic for-profit entity is not a good idea.
That undemocratic for-profit entity is a state corporation
This private company you're fearing is in fact a State-owned pension fund. CDPQ is literally owned by the government and the profits go directly into taxpayers' pockets.
@@Jessyjames24 it being owned by the state doesn’t stop making it a for-profit institution. It is privatisation because the elected institutions do not have control over the system. An unaccountable for-profit institution is in-charge. The profit-motive does not go away.
@@strawberry7799a oh you're one of those "it's bad because it makes profit" types 😬
@@MG-mo7ib i’m one of those who thinks the public should control the infrastructure, and the infrastructure should first and foremost serve its purpose. Profit-motive increases the chance of the project deviating from that purpose.
A pension fund, even publicly-owned, has a profit-motive. A pension fund is also less accountable to the public because it is an arms-length away from the elected govt.
The Caisse’s interest is making a profit out of the REM. Their interest is not serving the transport needs of Montrealers as effectively as possible.
I understand your point but stopping at Honoré-Beaugrand would save a few millions per kilometres and bring the north arm of REM to Pie-IX station would cost a lot less and it’s us tax payers who will pay the bill at the end. On the other hand, I’m living on the north shore near Deux-Montagnes and REM de l’Est is far from me. Although I’m a native from Tétraultville and quite frankly using the train track between Souligny and DuBuisson streets is far fetch. Getting in by George V boulevard but getting out by which street? Honoré-Beaugrand street isn’t large enough, other streets like DesOrmeaux, Pierre-Bernard or Lebrun are way too narrow to go back to Sherbrooke so last alternative would be by the Highway 25 but then last stop would be Radisson which doesn’t make sense at all. What would make much more sense would be start by Sherbrooke street at the east tip of the island (for Repentigny users) and follow Sherbrooke street all the way at ground level up to Georges V where it goes above ground a bit like the west arm of REM (1) and stop at H.Beaugrand to prevent doubling services and raise the frequency of the green line to a train every 3 minutes (to allow the preceding train to arrive at the next station) and this wouldn’t be 70 minutes to get to McGill like you say but more like 50 minutes to get from east end to McGill. Even if it takes 70 minutes, it’s a major improvement then take a car from Pointe-aux-Trembles to downtown which can take more than an hour with traffic. And you know I’m not saying this to piss you off but to be logic and cost effective because you know just like me that REM (1) won’t cost 7 billions $ like CDPQ said but more like 9 or 10 billions $ like most government driven projects are. They will use COVID excuse or work delay to justify the overboard cost it generates. How many times did they delay the launch of the south branch up to now 3 or 4 times how much those delays cost…. That’s why I’m saying to stay cost effective because REM de l’Est will cost more that 10 billions $ to get downtown and it still us tax payers that pays the cost at the end.
th-cam.com/video/vKAl6DOcASc/w-d-xo.html
World class transit systems are reliable and fast. A single line with technology that travels at half the speed is neither fast or reliable.
To my mind, the question isn't if the REM est is a good idea or not, but is it the best way to spend 10 billion on transit in the east end
The best transit is the transit we build. There will always be people to find issues with a project. I'm so glad Quebec are finally getting their tram. A metro on the tramway alignement, trams where the feeder brt were planned and investment in regional rail would have better, but there's no way I'd condone sabotaging the Quebec Tramway project because it's not "the best".
@@MG-mo7ib so should the ARTM simply be abolished? Simply accept whatever project the provincial government decides it wants to fund?
I'm not suggesting the REM be cancelled, but we should not be so dismissive when a planning body actually tries to plan
@@ramsaymayka9978 But that's the thing though, the ARTM hasn't put much work into planning since its inception. Their last PSD is a mess. The ARTM should strive to be more like CDPQi instead of undermining them. A state corporation with it's own streams of revenu, a functional independence from local mayors, provincial ministers, and isn't bogged down by every interest group and years of consultation circuits. They should also move away from car-centric practices like planning 1000+ place of free park-and-ride for a station, or going to court to expropriate land.... to build parkings bigger than stations. The ARTM hasn't had the best practices . Maybe that's a cultural legacy from the AMT, that also bleed into the STM and other agencies. Instead of reflecting on their own internal problems, they've lashed out at the new operator and asked for more money... not for an alternative project in particular, but to keep the bureaucratic machine working. That's not a very pro-transit user mindset.
I understand that there's a narrative in the video, but you're pushing it without acknowledging the issues of the projects and it makes you sound like you're doing an ad. I usually love your work, and the video is of good quality, but this topic deserves much more nuance than you gave it
The video (and the rest of the series) overtly acknowledges the issues of the project, and actually brings much of the nuance missing from the discourse on the project. Your comment make it sound like you’ve been really selective with what you’ve heard and just hurried to write your take.
You know this is video five in an ongoing series right? If you’re looking for more context you will find it there
@@TD-gc5tq On the contrary, I follow the project quite actively. I think the tone of his video is more about making fun of the opposition of the REM 2 by completely dismissing their points in a ridiculing way. The reality is somewhere in the middle, and it's frustrating how he's not acknowledging that in this specific video
@@grundewa Yes, I've been liking the series. My criticism is only about this specific video, and to a much lesser extent the previous one
@@williamdion1236 maybe, but at some point that just becomes about sustaining a false balance. Say he sees the ARTM methodology and conclusions as substandard and dubious, how indulgent does he have to be when talking about it?
Imo the REM should be merged with the metro so that switching from REM to metro doesn't cost money which would make transit more efficient