Stop Using Plywood To Make Cabinets!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.พ. 2024
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I will never stop using plywood. And I would use it over pine any day of the week because it's stronger, less prone to warping, and I can get a selection of veneers to match the doors and drawer fronts. I prefer oak for doors and drawer fronts for its looks and durability. Pine is too soft to take the abuse of a kitchen cabinet door or drawer front.
Cheers.
Exactly, pine is fucking trash lol. It's soft, fragile, get's scratched or dented easily, doesn't stain or paint well, etc.
Not to mention the ungodley amount of time he's spending!!!
At least look at the price of hard maple. Many times I have been able to save money verses clear pine. It is way more durable and can look amazing.
Home depot stocks various widths of birch at relatively reasonable prices that are really good for small solid cabinet door fronts and for stiles&rails for the larger doors with use of thin plywood sheathing insetted for the panels. I still like pine for cabinet sides, again with plywood sheathing in a rabbet for cabinet backs
For the average guy, this is the kind of video that is the most useful. Most of us have a limited assortment of wood working tools, limited space and are left to work with poorer quality wood. Thanks for the great tips and showing how to do some woodworking without 25K worth of state of the art equipment in a three car garage LOL.
Yeah I suppose I might be deranged or cheap, but I love pine. I like the challenge of taking something cheap or looked down on and turning it into something nice.
yeah the thing I hate about working with pine is I always manage to drop it or whack it on something denting the hell out of it
@@contestwill1556 That can at least be avoided by learning to be careful. The think I hate the most is all those damn knots in the wood from old branches. They can be pretty, but they're a b*tch to work with
Yeah like having a joiner, a 12 or 14 inch planer, or that expensive dowel jig, not to mention that really nice table saw and router table. I forgot to mention the shoulder plane that even he said was expensive. Most people have a jobsite table saw, chop saw or regular circular saw for the average guy! And I guarantee you that it's ever bit of 25K worth of tools he's using!
LOL I just got done working on a pine project, and had to fill in some dings. I wondered how much damage was done to that panel he dropped. A smashed corner is the worst.@@contestwill1556
FWIW: Pegboard cut into strips makes a good positioning jig for shelf pins
If you don't care about the standard 32mm spacing. Jigs aren't all that expensive.
@@kwilliams2239 The pegboard I used had 1" spacing: 32mm is a little more than 1- 1/4". As long as the spacing is consistent (IE don't mix 1" and 32mm) I don't think it matters?
@@gregtaylor3432 Depending on the application, maybe. Standards are there for a reason. Templates can he had for $10. For $10, there is no reason not to use the standard spacing and setbacks.
If I recall correctly, the 32mm standard was created because that was as close as whoever came up with it could get the heads of the pin drilling machine. Sometimes (not to say frequently) the reason for the standard isn't a grand master plan, it's some practical limitation to somebody long ago.
@@disco_falcon1895 OK, Some say that the standard rail gauge is 4' 8-1/2", which has been used for hundreds of years, has it's history (arguably) going back to the Roman's chariots. It doesn't really matter how it got here, it's not called the "Standard Rail Gauge" for nothing.
If you want to use standard hardware, use the standards. Now, why are there both 1/4" and 5mm holes?😁
Having grown up with plywood being cheaper than solid lumber, the new paradigm is weird to me. But making panels out of pine is actually really fun. I've been doing it using a biscuit joiner for years and years. Two new things you taught me in this video: the I/O trick (one of those "why didn't I think of that?" ideas) and doing a quick hand planing to clean up unevenness in the joints. I've always just sanded, but hand planing seems like a time saver. Great video!
It's only cheaper if your time has no value.
@@lavransmathiesen9099 Really the cheapest plywood is 30 dollars a sheet. There is never a need that you should have to have high grade plywood for cabinets. A simple quick sand on a large belt sander machine and a spray on the inside is really all you need.
Those people who would rather spend 80 dolllars a sheet for sanded plywood for something that is not going to be seen is beyond me.
@@kameljoe21 well- by the time you run it through the wide belt, get it in a spray booth, seal, sand, and finish coat (not to mention paying for the finish and sandpaper), even $110/sheet prefin maple is cheaper than a shop-grade plywood. There is no $30/sheet ply available in Seattle. Even the MDF is $35/sheet or more.
Now, if it's the pine option, then the cost for that here is $12.72/board for 1x6, making it $114.48 for 32 square feet (equal to a sheet of plywood).
It's way more fun to build with solid stock, though. Just not cheaper than plywood.
I honestly don't know what he's talking about. Cabinet grade plywood is about $65 for a full sheet where I'm at. Those S4S pine boards are like ten bucks a pop at the same store for an 8ft long, 4.5 inch wide one, and they aren't flat and have loose knots and sap pockets etc.
@@lavransmathiesen9099
You are entirely correct!
With the exception of certain work the $35-$40 1/2” ‘sande’ plywood at homerdespot (maybe more $ now?) is fantastic for carcass and face frame construction. Solid wood is for furniture and trim imho, or when you require the esthetic.
Probably you’re thinking same, but I’d have a plywood carcass ready for five minutes of assembly before getting boards prepped to drill for dowels. And I’d never dowel a carcass or door stiles and rails when other methods would do it in seconds while being just as strong or stronger.
OMG Best Video Ever! Finally someone explains the steps to using solid wood for cabinets without glossing over too much and at the same time keeping the whole build simple and achievable for the average Joe! Bravo. Btw I really enjoy how you make your workshop look classy and functional!
Thanks for the kind words!
Will you share the brand and color of stain please? Thanks.
@@jenniepost7837You need to tag him in your comment if you want to have any chance of him seeing it given it’s a response to someone’s comment. You really would be better off posting it as an original comment of your own though as someone else might know the answer, possibly based on finishes he has generally used in the past.
Actual woodworking tips and not just more TH-camr BS. Another banger from Scotty B Walsh
Save the real wood for the face frames, doors, & drawers. The reason that plywood is used, is it resists warping a bit more than solid wood, it's stronger overall, allowing for use of thinner & cheaper carcass material. It's a HUGE time saver, no glue-up of multiple boards to get the right size & no waiting for glue to set - just cut to size, sand, finish, and assemble - YES, I put finish before assembly. Plywood is also typically cheaper per board foot (prices will vary wherever you live so always shop around), costing me about $5/bf locally for Baltic Birch ($61.74 for 5ftx5ft sheet of 12mm / $92.37 for 5ftx5ft sheet of 18mm) and that is with 1 cut for transport, and including sales tax. There are only 11 species & thicknesses of lumber at my local 'hardwood' lumber yard that are cheaper... knotty pine (4/4, 5/4 & 8/4), knotty alder (4/4 & 8/4), poplar (4/4, 5/4, 6/4, & 8/4) & basswood (4/4 & 8/4). Most are only a few cents per board foot cheaper, with the exception of knotty pine being as little as $3.21/bf for 8/4 & $3.84/bf for 4/4 or 5/4.
Do you understand why he's doing it this way? It's on purpose.
I am a newcomer to your videos. This is the first one that I have watched and I find it so refreshing to see someone put craftsmanship into a project rather than assembly line construction. You explain every reason why you do something a particular way and it makes so much sense. I think I have found a new favorite woodworking channel.
This has to be one of your best videos. I’ve been following you for quite a while and I really appreciate how you teach in a different manner. It’s actually really refreshing to learn things rather than hearing the same mantra
Tip since you use it elsewhere - I have discovered that putting a piece of painters tape on my finished piece and then marking layouts on that, instead of the piece (like you did for hinges) is faster than erasing layout lines
love it! I have a forest of pine. I was toying with the idea of making kitchen cabinets entirely from pine from the forest. Now I know it will be doable and look great. Have sawmill, will saw! Thankyou you saved me a TON of cash in plywood casings. great video
Pine has never looked better! Great video and great work creating a beautiful set of cabs for your shop.
These are far nicer than most household cabinets that I have seen. Great work! Love it!
That beaded shiplap is stunning! I’m a huge fan of how beautiful aged pine looks.
Just found this channel thanks to the magic of the algorithm. Thanks TH-cam!! Great channel. Very nice sound and video quality.
Also, never would have thought to make panels out of pine to build cabinets instead of ply. GENIUS!
From my 15 years of experience in cabinet making, it’s way easier to completely assemble your cabinets, hang doors and mount hardware, while still on your bench. When it’s time to hang cabinets, pop doors off, hang your boxes then just snap doors onto hinge plates. It saves you from having to mess around with clamps, and measuring for hinge plates in awkward positions. To each their own. Good work.
You always take the time and effort to make all your projects beautiful no matter what materials you use. Looks super professional
I've been thinking about making cabinets out of edge-jointed, solid wood for a while now. Seeing this video has revived my motivation to give it a shot. Thanks, Scott Walsh! 👍🏻
It's fantastic how you go over each step in such detail, and point out the mistakes you have *prevented*! And it must be said, the end result looks amazing!!
First video of yours I have seen, subscribed. Love the detailed step by step instructions and craftmanship
When you just "make my own shelf pin hole jig" and you crank something out that is both fully functional and versatile aligning in multiple scenarios, you know this is not your first carpentry project. Nice work and nice demonstration of being a thoughtful self-sufficient woodworker. Now just finding the right place to store the jig for future use.... but I digress.
First time watching your content. Can’t say I’ll make cabinets this way but I’m blown away with what you can do in a small area. Like wow.
Have to say, this is the first video I watched from you, and it definitely has the most comedic value than any other woodworking/how-to/DYI/etc. I have watched😄 Also it feels very down to earth type of doing. Very good👍🏼
I recently started a project building custom shelving in my walk in closet and when I was pricing wood sanded plywood was cheaper than similar pine in my area (Nashville TN). Especially when you take into account the time savings associated with the plywood vs glue ups etc. And when using plywood no cupping issues etc.
Super cool project and video Scott! Love the structure of your videos, and they sound great too!
Awesome build. Thank you so much for sharing.
Wow! Your cabinets look amazing!
Awesome to see a Canadian woodworking YT channel doing great content.
No offense to Scott…but…Rob Cosman?
Canadians who are good at woodworking? Who would have thought? Wood is so rare in Canada… 😂😂
Canadians also invented the Robertson screwdriver and screws.
Definitely one of the funniest and revolutionary carpenters on youtube still able to gain as much views on the old topic like cabinet! Yours is posh!!!! sharp jokes and relaxing approach - super!
Really nice-looking cabinets. I do not begin to have any of your shop tools, but the video was still fun and instructive. My last project was making a 4 shelf stand for holding my game consoles, CD player and the inevitable clutter with Purple Heartwood.
Ever since I got into doing some furniture making, I don’t know why more beginners use pine? It’s cheap, it is soft but cheap! Great way to practice. I love the back panel btw!
This is the first video of yours I've seen. I really enjoyed it. You gave me lots of great ideas. I appreciate it.
Plywood is expensive, sure, but where do you get pine cheaper?
And the price of clear pine makes plywood an easy choice.
@@steadyeddie7453 I've found red oak cheaper than clear pine. Crap pine is more expensive than ply, and a lot harder to work with.
Now, if the comparison is to Baltic birch? Well, you're way richer than I. I'd rather use walnut.😵
@@kwilliams2239 Agree with you on the cost of red oak vs clear pine. Knotty pine isn't worth the frustration. Too many problems. But I am a snob for the Baltic Birch. Zero voids, zero knots, stays flat, machines easily. All the drawers I make are BB, along with many of the jigs over the years. Expensive, yes. But I wait for Rockler to have a sale then head to my new Fairfax, Va store to avoid the shipping.
@@steadyeddie7453 was at Woodcraft this afternoon. A 2'x4' sheet of 3/4" *American* birch was $100. $400 a sheet?! For American?!
I bought some American Birch from Rockler a while back (don't get there often). It wasn't nearly as expensive as the Baltic but it had voids in it. Sheesh.
Might just as well stick with box store hardwood ply. Just remember not to sand the picture of wood off it.
@@kwilliams2239 I would guess that the American birch you are referring to is Appleply. I have yet to try it. From what I was told, when Russia invaded Ukraine, the price of BB skyrocketed. My local H.D. sometimes has decent hardwood ply, depending on where they get it. But make no mistake, it is never the quality of BB.
Just Wow, first of all you make fantastic videos. Just a pleasure to watch. It makes these projects just seem so approachable and fun. Second of all, the Cabinets look fantastic.
Started watching this not knowing what it was but more interested in the process of design once i realised what it is and how good the design and build quality is i'm going to buy one. I am so impressed with your attention to detail. Congrats on an amazing build.
Wow I’m so glad I found you! Totally reigniting my passion.
Very nice! Great video, concise, many tips and--above all--practical all the way through.
My only gripe is the handles: too modern looking for a traditional/rustic design. I guess, since these are intended for a workshop they may be preferred on reasons of practicality.
One last thing: this was strangely relaxing for carpentry video which are usually very highly strung. I don't know why most carpentry videos are done that way but they definitely don't have to be as this one clearly shows!
beautiful craftsmanship
Beautiful job Scott!
And always a good thing to see the dowelmax get a workout!
Speaking of which, for future reference, you can you use your dowelmax to make a shelf pin jig and have very accurately spaced holes.
Catch you on the next one!
Those cabinets are clean and solid. Love this Scott !
I'm having a really hard time understanding how S4S Pine being around 48 square inches per dollar, that you still have to edge joint, vs over 92 square inches per dollar for nice sanded plywood is better?
It's not.
Hey dude, I only discovered your videos a week ago, and I just wanted to say that I love your vibe! You're fun to watch!
Great video! Everything is to the point, I’m a professional carpenter and this is how we do the high end cabinets for those multi million dollar homes, no plywood just hardwood (white oak), what a good job man, keep it up!
I made a pin jig very similar to yours years ago and color coded the corners so I could remember which way it needed to be oriented... For the same reasons you mentioned needing to remember the orientation.
Hang on, I'm gonna replace all my cabinets with plywood just out of spite
Is it really cheaper to use pine boards in materials cost?
And when you factor in the time for joining boards...
I like a back to square my cabinets.
And I am a dowel convert. I used to try to build everything with pocket screws, but I like my dowel plus glue results much better.
If you like dowels then try biscuits. A Porter Cable biscuit jointer costs about the same as the Dowelmax jig. And biscuits are 1000% easier to install. Dowels have to be dead nuts on with their mating holes. Biscuit slots allow for some movement for perfect alignment.
The wood might be a little cheaper but doubt that the saving compensates for the added time. First time I've seen this channel, video was good but yet another TH-camr that doesn't outline costs when making claims about savings 🤷🏻♂️
Those doors are beautiful!! Well done.
Fantastic! Pre glued pine boards is basically the only readily available lumber where I live, except for construction lumber.
I much admire this efficient and well-appointed workshop and the many nice procedures demonstrated here. Very nice use of tools! I don't have as many good tools, or even an actual workshop, so I'm afraid my cabinets are not as lovely as these. However, my cabinets also do not involve as much labor as shown here, which in my view is quite a lot to achieve the final product. Anyway, this is a great instructive video, and I enjoy Scott and his presentation style!
Very awesome work! 🙏🏼
Glad more people come around to use pine. Esp with lumber prices as they are. Sure you can dent pine with a fingernail, BUT, how often do you run around and try to damage your cabinets? I just made modern style doors out of pine, to freshen up my grandma's old kitchen. Added an off white stain and a small vertical router line. Some modern door handels, a bit of a round over and the kitchen looks as good as new_ish.
I really like the use of solid pine. The more I use plywood the more I dislike it. This was a great video. I don't know how I missed it for that last two months. I wonder what else I have missed.
The sliding, sliding compound miter saw is just insane.. excellent content sir!
Those cabinets look really nice 👌 seems very approachable for an average person with not too many tools in their arsenal. I like those panels on the inside of the cabinets.
Some may say these are too nice for a workshop; however, I also like having nice-looking cabinets in my work area. So much so that I have had people remark that my workshop looks more and more like a kitchen every time they see it.
Thanks for the video, Scott!
First time I have ever seen you and I will be making mine the same way. to copy is flattery, so they say. I don't have space for much wood working and this doesn't require that many.
I really like how you did everything.
But as a youtube commenter I have to pick about the finish. Pine bleeds like crazy so the only thing that will keep these from getting brown orange, is to seal them with shellac, or shellac based primer ("Kilz Original", and some other one I can't pronounce or spell). Do NOT worry and waste your time what it looks like, just be sure to cover it all. Even if you are going to paint these, the sap will bleed right through your paint if not sealed.
You might have used a clear shellac so just to warn others about it. Thanks and subscribed. I was going to ask if you can do the same thing for base cabinets but you just answered that. Thanks again.
Man, Sundays are my favourite. All my woodworking TH-camrs post videos. Great vid! You are absolutely the best for entertainment and engagement. Love your stuff
Wow, these look great!
Great project thanks for sharing
Those jack mitres are sweet. Well done, boy!
If you want to try something different, I made drawers (6) by taking a 2x4x8 cutting into the proper lenghts, then cutting them down to 1/2" and using the left over piece for the bottom. Quick and fast and they hold heavy food items, and have for years. I attached them to full pull out drawer guides.
I've actually made drawers like this! Cheapest drawer ever! 😂
Remember: clamping with too much pressure will cause cupping. Use a ruler to check if there's bowing. If there is, reduce pressure on the clamps until it goes away
I know you keep saying they're "just shop cabinets" but so you're aware, I have 50 year old cedar cabinets in my kitchen which I absolutely adore and yours are infinitely better, congrats, subbed
In my area (Oregon) pine seems to cost as much as oak or maple. The cheap woods are big leaf maple, alder, and poplar. Seems like this would work just fine with any of those woods as well.
handheld router. Haha. Years ago when I was building one of my catamaran designs in a friend's garage, I had only one power tool: a drill. I didn't need any others. I hand cut the plywood. A good saw makes that work. But then I needed to do a roundover before applying the FRP sheathing to the deck. I borrowed my friend's router. Saved lots of time (probably 3 hours at least) and came out perfect and uniform.
Well I have to tell you, that I have been doing DIY for years, and watching video's, and I must yours is absolutely brilliant not only the wood working but with a funny side too, you might not think that but I you were great, cant wait to see more of them, and what a bonus, in real wood too yippeee. Keep up the good work, thank you
Awesome job Scott. It's a great weekend watching some of your build videos.
Dowelling frame and panel door is a great alternative to mortise and tenon joints for shop projects.
Very good work.👍
when you clamp the cauls how do you stop the glue squeezeout gluing the cauls to the panel?
great video. really awesome work and its fun to watch.
This looks insane! So much work! If just one person built a machine that can do that instead, all of humanity would take advantage and nobody would ever have to do this manually again.
nice work and great explanations....
Wow Scott’s woodwork shop has really grown. I remember when he was just getting started with used machinery.
Very nice video, Scott, you make it so easy as it is lovely to watch when everything fits together..... yes one day I may need to do this too. Thumbs up & subscribed.Best of luck.
One issue with pine and spruce however is that it doesn't take stain evenly. I solved this for one project by taking a can of dye based wood stain, and mixing it with equal volume varnish. In my case both were water based. Then applied a zillion coats, very lightly sanding with 600 grit wet sand paper between coats. The win was that with water based stain, I could put a coat on every 30 minutes. Using the paper wet, kept the dust down. Even so, I set up two benches -- one to sand on, and one to stain on.
I find that a curved tip dental syringe is super for dispensing glue precisely and controllably where it is needed in the amount required. It is easy to fill and to cap up with a toothpick after dispensing the glue.... Dental syringes are very inexpensive and can be used disposably when you are not going to use them again for a long time. They are particularly useful for injecting glue under loose portions of veneer when repairing furniture.
Great job!
Freakin' amazing. I'm currently putting together some RTA cabinets for my kitchen. The Rustic Hickory came from the Amish and had nice jointery. My island cabinets came from Vietnam and the only good joints were on the drawers which were rounded finger joints. It's pretty eye opening at how different cabinets can be made. Luckily lots of glue and my brad nailer are helping fix the issues I have with their plywood construction.
Great recommendation and good practice. For people needing a more time/labor efficient approach you might want to mention multi-layer softwood panels. Trade-offs...
Great looking and love that you used pine, Scott!
I think all the Canadians are in cahoots on promoting the DowellMax.
Great cabinets, scott! Look great.
A great Australian invention/company :)
Funny that they don't promote the Canadian company that also makes a nice doweling jig (Jessem).
Also of the Tim Horton's (which I do order down here in South Carolina).
awesome vid. hope all is well with you man, keep the content coming. life's good.
I'm actually using pine for a piece of furniture right now. Still cladding it with thin plywood though because it finishes better.
Everything you did looks so weird compared to what we do in europe. We use metal pins to hold our shelves, and so on. Ikea has a pretty similar stile to these cabinets, even in colour.
Even you method of the door hinge application is so different. Thank you.
Oh cool, all I need is a jointer and I don’t need to buy plywood anymore! 😂
Fabulous work. The cabinets are better made and look good enough for kitchen cabinets. Nothing like solid wood construction.
"I'm no longer tripping over as much stuff" 😂 story of my life. Tripping on stuff in the shop is my favorite hobby, some days it's all I do! Unless I'm taking breaks to drop stuff or knock stuff over.
Great video. Informative and entertaining.
Nice work! 👍
Love the dowel jig! Do you have a video on a simple cross cut jig perhaps - thank you
Great Video!!!
Great job Scott. Thanks for showing us how it’s done. And I thought I had the world’s smallest shop….
I'm learning so much from your videos Scott. Thank you. Did I miss it - I'm not seeing a reference/link for your shoulder plane? Is that Veritas large shoulder plane?
Clean work
Nice video! Keep up the good work. Question. Do you buy your lumber from a big box store or if not, where do you suggest others buy it from?
seems like the pine will cost alot more then plywood
It cost me $3.34 a bdft. Since there's 24 bdft in a 4x8 sheet of plywood, it's equivalent to an $80 sheet, which is exactly what purebond poplar core plywood costs at home depot, and that's the least expensive plywood I would consider using.
Besides, plywood is no fun. I enjoy working with solid wood and that's that.
@@ScottWalshWoodworking plywood is no fun so true
@@ScottWalshWoodworking Folks should consider not only the cost but also how handling 4x8-3/4" plywood is a PIA - especially in a one-person small or basement shop. Boards are easy to transport, break down to rough length, can be worked with hand tools if one is so inclined. The tradeoff is time (cost is about the same for me around MA) unless you find some deals on lumber - like from a local saw mill. I built a full set of kitchen cabinets (base and wall) in pine in a 1 car garage workshop in 1990 in my wife and my first house. They were unique, custom, and beautiful.
Great video. Slick and smoove.
Just checked prices at Home Depot. A 1 x 8 x 8 common pine board costs $17.33. Figuring 20% waste in machining the boards into your cabinet project, the pine costs $4.40 per SF. A sheet of 3/4" pine sanded plywood at Home Depot costs $51.78, or, figuring 10% waste (waste could actually be close to 0% if you dimension your cabinets in a way to eliminate waste), costs $1.78 per SF. This is not to mention all the additional time (and tools) needed to get the pine boards into a place where they can form the cabinet parts. You are looking at around 3 times the cost building the cabinets out of solid pine as opposed to using plywood. And thats for common pine, which will have a ton of knots in it. Bump that up to select pine and the costs will be astronomical.
If you want to make your cabinets out of solid pine, great, but don't say that you saved all this money over using plywood - it's just not so.
And the whole reason cabinets and other wood furniture is made with plywood or MDF as the core is because of the price and their stability in varying humidity conditions. That pine, especially the doors, is going to warp. But he did help by finishing the wood inside and out. And does good work. I just wouldn't have chosen pine. And the door center panel need to float in the rails and stiles for expansion.
@@steadyeddie7453 Righteo.
@@steadyeddie7453 Have made cabinets both ways. I do kitchen type cabinets from plywood for efficiency. |I make furniture cabinets from solid wood for satisfaction doing it as a high-end product. Have had a problem with using solid maple for a fairly small cabinet with the wood warping after it was finished. And that wood was well aged so it shouldn't have had that much moisture content. Grrrr.
@@johnburton2338 I agree with everything you said. My biggest learning curve was not the machining of the wood products, it is knowing which wood to choose for a particular project. Knowing how that wood is going to expand and contract. I used to glue up solid everything I built. No longer. But basically long thin wood like for rails and styles that are secured on the ends only I go with very well seasoned wood to prevent warp, curling. etc. Drawers are always baltic birch sides w/ ply bottoms. Cabinet sides will be furniture grade ply or MDF laminated with a beautiful veneer. Guaranteed flat for years. Solid maple is beautiful wood but the hard stuff is extrememly dense. I always take small bites to avoid the heat and stress. And when I plane rough sawn to thickness I do it over a few days to let it relieve stresses overnight.
Dude! You're on your way to a million subscribers. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the video!
Is this pine wood treated for repelling termites?