As a doctor who works with kidney patients every day, I must say this was a very interesting video! I talk a lot about diet and kidney health in my channel as well. And I wanted to mention that, as Dr. Layne Norton says, the fact that a moderately elevated protein intake has kidney protecting benefits only holds true for healthy kidneys. As soon as kidney function drops below a certain point, protein becomes a cause for damage. This is important to mention because a lot (and I mean a lot) of people have kidney disease and they don't know it. This is a silent disease.
Please explain how my mother was stage 4 renal failure and reversed it in 6 months by eating nothing but steak and eggs then... Almost 3 years now, and her function is around 86-90%
@@_carnivore_joe1520 I’m no expert on kidney health but come on. That’s just a single anecdote. Medicine relies on higher quality evidence. I’m glad your Mum’s kidney function improved though.
Nice to see Layne not yelling like in most videos, but what was this no link between brain and kidneys, you guys think brain is not aware anything kidneys do(?)
How do you go about gaining muscle and losing fat if you have lower kidney function if you can't eat protein? Can people with kidney problems eat any protein?
Elon musk says cow farms barely even measurable and negligible affect on climate. They want u weak, take away what gives u confidence. Cows raised on pretty rough land and the cow paddies rejuvenate the land?
I love that you refer to studies like this! I found out about peer-reviewed work and fell in love.. leaving the world of reading fiction for decades...
Ive worked with alot of people. Those with the highest bodyfats and poorest health typically consume the lowest protein diets. I'm also positive there are socioeconomic issues here. The families and individuals that are on the lowest income spectrum eat the most processed, low protein, higher sugar/carb diets. Adversely, those in the mid to upper income spectrum eat much more protein and fresh foods. They're usually more quality conscious as well and are often able to afford supplemental protein. So when i hear these claims about "too much protein," I always reply: actually, most of us dont get enough.
The two top causes of ckd are diabetes and hypertension. Neither are caused by eating diets high in protein. We should be focusing on staying metabolically healthy and controlling hypertension rather than telling people to limit protein intake, especially since the SAD is protein-deficient anyway
Was just researching this recently since I eat around 200 grams per day with 30-40% of my protein coming from plant sources. Great video and I'll continue eating plenty protein!
Commenting to bump this because people need to a) check their kidney function with a doctor and b) stop being afraid of protein if their kidneys are healthy. I've heard protein and CKD being compared to running on healthy vs. broken legs - running is healthy if your legs are fine, and a serious problem if they aren't.
This is very good news for me. My maintenance calories are quite high for my weight so I often eat 2.2-3g per kg just from whole foods. I don’t supplement or intentionally choose protein rich foods and animal products aren’t a big source of calories in my diet. A doctor once told me my protein intake is too high but I couldn’t figure out how to reduce it significantly while still getting enough calories from well balanced meals so I just ignored the advice and tried not to worry about it.
@ It’s possible because I weigh 65kg so 2.2-3g per kg is only 143-195g. My maintenance is typically roughly 3300 calories but can be upwards of 4000 when I’m really enjoying zone 2 and sprint training.
@@bancy1527 Probably gets a lot of calories. I do the same thing. About 3k calories a day. Lots of legumes and vegetables (% protein per calorie is generally high). Physical all day so it all gets burned off.
@Dr Layne Norton - any chance you could do a video on if leaky gut syndrome is real / cause skin issues etc also can excess calories cause skin issues like acne etc? I’ve been so confused around all the different advice that diet causes acne / it doesn’t but now I’ve seen stuff saying a surplus of calories can cause acne / a deficit can reduce acne. This is making my weight lifting journey a nightmare to progress around food intake.
As a cardiology person who deals with kidney disease as part of our work, and we do see increases in renal values in patients with renal disease who eat high protein diets, I have often wondered how the normal kidney handles lots of protein. 🤔
"renal values"? U mean S. Creatinine. S. Cystatin C is a way better test for kidney function, as creatinine will be elevated in people with higher rates of muscle turnover and normal kidney function (such as high protein intake with resistance training) So try Cystatin C
I have CKD and my doc advised me to not eat a high protein diet. I guess a lot of folks don't know that they have kidney damage and it might be a good idea to check this first before delving into a high protein diet.
@biolayne The study you are citing in the video and the screenshots from its abstract and table is a study on the relationship between protein intake and all-cause mortality, not incidence of CKD. While other studies may have reached the conclusion you mention in the video (ie. protein intake does not lead to CKD) but that is not what this JAMA study is about.
It would be great if “high” “moderately high” etc can be quantified and further stratified by meat versus plant. At 72 and 63 kg male I am doing about 70-75 gms of plant (tofu/nuts) and dairy protein (yogurt/whey) a day to maintain muscle mass. Don’t eat meat hardly, ever. Is that considered low, moderate or what for highly active hiker 4-7 miles most days on Sierra Nevada mountain trails and every other to every 3 days resistance exercises for legs/arms/core.
I increased my protein from about 1.0 to 1.4 --1.7 per Kilogram My BUN is now slightly out of range at 21 -23. I can't say whether that relates to protein or high levels of exercise, but my BUN has never been out of range in the past and I have had high levels of exercise in the past.
I know anecdote isn't great evidence but this is a high interest area for me because my grandfather died from kidney failure after eating 200g/day for 40 years straight
Let's not forget that we're talking about COOKED protein here (which is denatured so more is needed). Just a thought to ponder. Do with it as you will.
Ok, I will disregard it, because it is a stupid statement. Protein will denature once it comes into contact with the stomach acid anyways, and it will be broken down even further before entering the blood stream.
Hello Dr. Layne. Is there a correlation between moderate to high protein diets and increased susceptibility to gout attacks ? Many doctors I’ve spoken to say an increased protein intake can potentially increase uric acid and creatinine levels. Can you clarify this?
One fact to consider is that older people following the advice to lower protein intake have an increased risk of sarcopenia and age related mobility decline. Its a choice. Gamble on a maybe or run with a definite? I have been following a high protein diet for more than 20 years and all my markers were ok at my 50 health check. Its all individual specific really.
Any study on protein intake and longevity in older subject groups controlling variables like weight and exercise? I think lowering protein intake (from 200g to 100g) might be conducive to better health long term.
I wonder what about "problematic" kidneys, like when creatinine is substantially raised WITHOUT creatine or heavy training, in a sedentary person. Could be there something like plant protein protecting against worsened kidney function?
I second this. My doctor wanted me to take Zyrtec because by nasal passages appeared inflamed upon inspection after I mentioned food sometimes getting stuck in throat and always trying to clear my throat wether it’s just mocous or food particles, he blamed allergies, and rejected my inquiry about a throat stretching that my dad and brother had to have
Anyone with hayfever who exercises would say don't worry. My n=1 anecdote is that I make expected gains while taking it - not just in the gym but also during 30 years of riding mountain bikes in an environment where pollen is abundant and antihistamines are important to me. I don't know if there might be a demonstrable tiny effect in studies - but if there is then it's most likely not a significant one or people the world over would not take antihistamines if they do a lot of exercise. And even if it did have a tiny effect it would need balanced against the positives of outdoor exercise which has been shown to give additional overall health benefits compared to indoor exercise
Would love a video on folks with one kidney. My aunt is starting her fitness/nutrition journey, and I’m trying to help her. I told her she needs to just focus on hitting protein (.7 to 1g per lb of goal body weight) for now and we will adjust from there. Her goal weight is 180lbs… And the kicker is she only has one kidney so she is leery of taking in too much protein. I’m no expert, and I’m sure her doctor is pushing low protein. Help!!
Legumes (soy [preferably soy milk, tofu, natto], chickpeas, beans, lentils, etc.). Bob's Red brand has a high protein oat variety that has as much protein as chickpeas do naturally. Getting it from those is probably healthier than in powders. Tastier as well.
@@Eline_Meijer It does not. I get 190 grams of protein some days and I don't use protein powder and eat very little meat (only about 20 grams would be animal protein).
Doctor Jason Fung recetly uploaded a video that contradicts the traditional belief that someone engaged in weight training needs 1.6 to 2 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight, as this is considered the optimal amount to repair micro-damage through protein synthesis. In contrast, a sedentary person typically requires just 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight. He explains that 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight is sufficient to build muscle and anything extra ingested protein turns to glucose and stored in the cells so body utilises even little amount of protein most effectively without having to take so much protein
Given the amount of contrary research that is out there on that subject and Fung's general unreliability as a source, I'm highly skeptical of that claim.
About reverse causality- there might not be a link that makes people with healthy kidneys eat more protein, but could there be a link whereby people with less healthy kidneys eat less protein (perhaps because it makes them feel unwell)?
I mean, if person's kidneys are damaged, body needs to repair them with something. That's one way how high protein intake might have protective effect.
@@0TheLastLoneWolf I know that kidneys don't repair as liver does, but they do at some capacity. If protein facilitates repair at just a bit higher rate, than rate at which ammonia damaging kidneys, then overall effect is positive.
It would be interesting if healthy kidneys somehow actually did have a linkage with the brain to cause high protein diets. Of course, this not at all what the scientific findings are saying, as explained in the video. But imagine if the health of the organs controlled the desire for the types of food consumed.
Some people notice that they have protein in their urine with a high protein diet. So i dont know if that means the kidneys can not handle that much protein or if its damaging over time. Some doctors and studies look at blood work to test kidney function. Anybody notice this? I think its called proteinuria
Most people don’t consume enough protein. If your kidneys are healthy don’t worry about it. If your kidneys are not healthy then consult a doctor. - I would imagine that everyone (healthy) can handle 150g protein everyday whereas 300 and 600g protein is very individually independent.
I think it depends on the type of protein and overall diet and hygiene. Think about this if amonia is up and toxins are up and cholesterol is up and antioxidants are down etc then would it not make sense that it would? I started eating About 250 grams and I was doing great until I ate 6 pounds of hamburger because I wanted cheap l carnitine. It wrecked me for several days. Well hamburger meat is not really that clean it’s highly processed and full of bad fat. Point is all protein is not the same.
I'm curious if it's at leaset partially a socioeconomic issue, as in poor people can't afford to buy higher quantities of protein. The other issue I could see is, I would assume people eating higher protein diets are also more likely to be exercising regularly.
I donated a kidney last year and wondered the same. The nephrologists will generally tell you to avoid high protein diets. I don’t like to ignore the professionals and have adjusted my protein intake downward toward 1.6 g per kg or 120 grams at 185lbs bodyweight (age 70). They would have preferred around 80 grams. Their rationale was ialthough current studies don’t show a negative effect, a single kidney.is working twice as hard to process the higher nitrogen load. I appreciate their honesty but believe they are still compelled to recommend the standard guideline to avoid legal repercussions from deviating from the norm. A nephrologist is only concerned about the kidneys, not the total human physiology. Each of us has the responsibility of balancing the various systems in our bodies to optimize overall health, for me that includes healthy muscle support.
@kurplop357 thanks for response. I was born with a single kidney so different situation. What I have read is that donors of kidneys may not be bad because in order to be able to donate you need to be very healthy. There was a recent study showing that people born with one kidney do have impaired late life health. And that studies showing no bad effect had all been on healthy donors. Either way, knowing protein and as you say, is the negative impact on kidney worth the benefits to rest of body. There is also treatments and technology that may change the kidney game in 10 20 years for people like you and me
@@bobbybrown1258 Good point. I was assuming a perfectly functioning kidney. Any propensity toward kidney disease, either genetic or compromised by past bad practices, should make one more cautious.
If I eat over 140 g of protein a day I will pee five times during the night, it doesn't happen if I don't eat the protein and I've been tested and there's no protein in my urine so I have no idea
@Layne I know how much of a fan you are of the carnivore diet. LOL However, my 70 year old mother was stage 4 renal failure a few years ago. She started eating only steak and eggs and within 6 months no longer was in failure. In fact after almost 3 years of eating this way, her labs indicated that she is 86+% kidney function and no longer needs to see her nephrologist. Not a "human randomized control trial". But we are fine with that.
Wow cool story. One time I cut my leg, then I started smoking cigarettes. A week later I was magically healed ! Clearly cigarettes having healing powers.
@@Greg_Chock Show me where I suggested lifestyle changes, I will wait... I simply reported that in my mother's experience. A damaged kidney was not further damaged by eating protein, and in fact the opposite was true. What's interesting, is that she's not alone. There are others that have reported the same.
Do we believe a guy who ends the video with an ad for his own ultra processed high protein product, or all the kidney physicians who shy away from high protein diets? Anyone can say anything on TH-cam to make sales, with no consequences if someone out there then follows that advice and gets ill down the line.
“The dose makes the poison.” 1.3grams is not high (actually its low) compared to what most bodybuilders and weightmen take. So for them this study has little to no value.
I'm a kidney donor. Having only one kidney, I get routine kidney checkups. Within the last year, I started body building. My last screening freaked my Dr out so bad that she immediately scheduled me for screenings, and visits with a specialist etc. This obviously freaked me out a bit, however I started reading peer reviewed studies on body builders and creatine supplements and how they can produce false, low kidney filtration quality. It sounds like many Drs are still not considered muscle mass when performing this test, which is critical. And some Drs are still demonizing creatine supplements. I haven't had my formal follow up exams, but I'm confident this will be a good conversation starter for increased muscle mass having a "false negative" effect on these screenings
I’m a donor also. My creatinine levels were high before I donated. The doctors quickly wrote that off as a result of muscle mass. My 24 hour tests came back showing kidney function more than twice the eGFR based on creatinine serum level. It becomes the new baseline for evaluating kidney function. High protein in the blood is usually caused by a high protein diet and muscle turnover in athletes. High levels of proteins in urine can be a reason for concern.
Antidotally speaking, I remember feeling the kidney pains when I was eating high protein while body building on a lacto-ovo vegetarian diet with whey protein shakes, and a couple times I actually smelled the ammonia on my breath!
How do you know its the protein intake? Pure carvinore could mean lots of other changes, like high saturated fats, lack of fiber, and certain micronutrient shifts.
Carnivore is more than just high protein. Besides eating 90+ percent meat is not just high protein, it's insanely high protein. My doc is very pleased with my blood test and I've been getting 1.5-2 g per kg bodyweight for years. But I do eat my veggies too and lots of dairy
As a doctor who works with kidney patients every day, I must say this was a very interesting video!
I talk a lot about diet and kidney health in my channel as well.
And I wanted to mention that, as Dr. Layne Norton says, the fact that a moderately elevated protein intake has kidney protecting benefits only holds true for healthy kidneys.
As soon as kidney function drops below a certain point, protein becomes a cause for damage.
This is important to mention because a lot (and I mean a lot) of people have kidney disease and they don't know it. This is a silent disease.
Please explain how my mother was stage 4 renal failure and reversed it in 6 months by eating nothing but steak and eggs then... Almost 3 years now, and her function is around 86-90%
@@_carnivore_joe1520 I’m no expert on kidney health but come on. That’s just a single anecdote. Medicine relies on higher quality evidence. I’m glad your Mum’s kidney function improved though.
@@_carnivore_joe1520 immunity improved and prob.fasted away some bacteria that were causing havoc, mouth, belly and ultimately from kidneys
Nice to see Layne not yelling like in most videos, but what was this no link between brain and kidneys, you guys think brain is not aware anything kidneys do(?)
How do you go about gaining muscle and losing fat if you have lower kidney function if you can't eat protein? Can people with kidney problems eat any protein?
I've wondered about this for some time. Thanks for sharing the video.
For the Al Gore dance rhythm. 🕺
That's an awesome obscure reference. 😂
@NewEnglandInSeattle lol thanks 😄
What's this in reference to lol?
@bruvhellnah Layne asks for people to comment for the algorithm, so I commented for Al Gore's dance rhythm 😁
Elon musk says cow farms barely even measurable and negligible affect on climate. They want u weak, take away what gives u confidence. Cows raised on pretty rough land and the cow paddies rejuvenate the land?
Great Video! Thank you 🔥👏💪🫶
I love that you refer to studies like this! I found out about peer-reviewed work and fell in love.. leaving the world of reading fiction for decades...
Ive worked with alot of people. Those with the highest bodyfats and poorest health typically consume the lowest protein diets.
I'm also positive there are socioeconomic issues here. The families and individuals that are on the lowest income spectrum eat the most processed, low protein, higher sugar/carb diets.
Adversely, those in the mid to upper income spectrum eat much more protein and fresh foods. They're usually more quality conscious as well and are often able to afford supplemental protein.
So when i hear these claims about "too much protein," I always reply: actually, most of us dont get enough.
The two top causes of ckd are diabetes and hypertension. Neither are caused by eating diets high in protein.
We should be focusing on staying metabolically healthy and controlling hypertension rather than telling people to limit protein intake, especially since the SAD is protein-deficient anyway
THIS! 👍
Was just researching this recently since I eat around 200 grams per day with 30-40% of my protein coming from plant sources. Great video and I'll continue eating plenty protein!
Having a higher protein goal when your sources are from plants is great.
For animals I would imagine 150g protein is more than enough.
Thats great. Research "quality of protein sources" Layne has a video about it. 200g of blant based protein a day is great.
Way too much protein. You should listen to reputable health organizations, not Layne Norton.
It's great that you've been researching this. Please tell us where you've published your research so we can take a look at your findings.
Commenting to bump this because people need to a) check their kidney function with a doctor and b) stop being afraid of protein if their kidneys are healthy. I've heard protein and CKD being compared to running on healthy vs. broken legs - running is healthy if your legs are fine, and a serious problem if they aren't.
This is very good news for me. My maintenance calories are quite high for my weight so I often eat 2.2-3g per kg just from whole foods. I don’t supplement or intentionally choose protein rich foods and animal products aren’t a big source of calories in my diet. A doctor once told me my protein intake is too high but I couldn’t figure out how to reduce it significantly while still getting enough calories from well balanced meals so I just ignored the advice and tried not to worry about it.
3g per kg from whole foods???? how is that even possible
@ It’s possible because I weigh 65kg so 2.2-3g per kg is only 143-195g. My maintenance is typically roughly 3300 calories but can be upwards of 4000 when I’m really enjoying zone 2 and sprint training.
@@bancy1527 Probably gets a lot of calories. I do the same thing. About 3k calories a day. Lots of legumes and vegetables (% protein per calorie is generally high). Physical all day so it all gets burned off.
@@acherontiaatropos6048 That's exactly it.
@@42Porter shi my bad I was not familiar with your game
@Dr Layne Norton - any chance you could do a video on if leaky gut syndrome is real / cause skin issues etc also can excess calories cause skin issues like acne etc? I’ve been so confused around all the different advice that diet causes acne / it doesn’t but now I’ve seen stuff saying a surplus of calories can cause acne / a deficit can reduce acne. This is making my weight lifting journey a nightmare to progress around food intake.
Would be much appreciated!
he has!
th-cam.com/video/fHZbMtcYyWQ/w-d-xo.htmlsi=MBbWW8tpxJJquQhf
Great stuff, thanks doc!
I work in healthcare and have asked a kidney dr. this specific question and said the same thing
This is very useful information to hear and consider.
As a cardiology person who deals with kidney disease as part of our work, and we do see increases in renal values in patients with renal disease who eat high protein diets, I have often wondered how the normal kidney handles lots of protein. 🤔
"renal values"?
U mean S. Creatinine.
S. Cystatin C is a way better test for kidney function, as creatinine will be elevated in people with higher rates of muscle turnover and normal kidney function (such as high protein intake with resistance training)
So try Cystatin C
Thanks Layne.
I have CKD and my doc advised me to not eat a high protein diet. I guess a lot of folks don't know that they have kidney damage and it might be a good idea to check this first before delving into a high protein diet.
@biolayne The study you are citing in the video and the screenshots from its abstract and table is a study on the relationship between protein intake and all-cause mortality, not incidence of CKD. While other studies may have reached the conclusion you mention in the video (ie. protein intake does not lead to CKD) but that is not what this JAMA study is about.
😳 uh oh
It would be great if “high” “moderately high” etc can be quantified and further stratified by meat versus plant. At 72 and 63 kg male I am doing about 70-75 gms of plant (tofu/nuts) and dairy protein (yogurt/whey) a day to maintain muscle mass. Don’t eat meat hardly, ever. Is that considered low, moderate or what for highly active hiker 4-7 miles most days on Sierra Nevada mountain trails and every other to every 3 days resistance exercises for legs/arms/core.
Great kidney information 💜
Outstanding content!
I increased my protein from about 1.0 to 1.4 --1.7 per Kilogram My BUN is now slightly out of range at 21 -23. I can't say whether that relates to protein or high levels of exercise, but my BUN has never been out of range in the past and I have had high levels of exercise in the past.
Love your content
Thanks once again
I know anecdote isn't great evidence but this is a high interest area for me because my grandfather died from kidney failure after eating 200g/day for 40 years straight
Let's not forget that we're talking about COOKED protein here (which is denatured so more is needed). Just a thought to ponder. Do with it as you will.
Ok, I will disregard it, because it is a stupid statement. Protein will denature once it comes into contact with the stomach acid anyways, and it will be broken down even further before entering the blood stream.
Why? As protein contracts water is removed. So the effective protein content in cooked meat is higher than in raw meat.
Raw meat gang checking in
thank you
Hello Dr. Layne. Is there a correlation between moderate to high protein diets and increased susceptibility to gout attacks ?
Many doctors I’ve spoken to say an increased protein intake can potentially increase uric acid and creatinine levels. Can you clarify this?
Dr Layne, I take 100mg a day of Ubiquinol for heart health. Do you think a higher dose could have a positive effect for strength/size gains?
My right knee, my left knee, and my kidney thanx u
One fact to consider is that older people following the advice to lower protein intake have an increased risk of sarcopenia and age related mobility decline. Its a choice. Gamble on a maybe or run with a definite?
I have been following a high protein diet for more than 20 years and all my markers were ok at my 50 health check. Its all individual specific really.
Thanks for presenting and explaining genuinely solid info in videos like this one. It's always helpful and reassuring.
Any study on protein intake and longevity in older subject groups controlling variables like weight and exercise? I think lowering protein intake (from 200g to 100g) might be conducive to better health long term.
all i can say is that most of these studies cant be applied to low carb or carnivore people because the subjects were on regular carb diets.
I wonder what about "problematic" kidneys, like when creatinine is substantially raised WITHOUT creatine or heavy training, in a sedentary person. Could be there something like plant protein protecting against worsened kidney function?
@@0TheLastLoneWolf thanks for the truism. Can you reference HRCT on people starting creatine intake with already affected kidney function?
Generally a good specialist with recommendation a reduction in protein intake around stage 4 kidney disease, definitely stage 5.
Hello Dr. Norton. Would you be interested in discussing about whether antihistamines such as cetirizine would negatively affect muscle growth?
I second this. My doctor wanted me to take Zyrtec because by nasal passages appeared inflamed upon inspection after I mentioned food sometimes getting stuck in throat and always trying to clear my throat wether it’s just mocous or food particles, he blamed allergies, and rejected my inquiry about a throat stretching that my dad and brother had to have
Anyone with hayfever who exercises would say don't worry.
My n=1 anecdote is that I make expected gains while taking it - not just in the gym but also during 30 years of riding mountain bikes in an environment where pollen is abundant and antihistamines are important to me.
I don't know if there might be a demonstrable tiny effect in studies - but if there is then it's most likely not a significant one or people the world over would not take antihistamines if they do a lot of exercise. And even if it did have a tiny effect it would need balanced against the positives of outdoor exercise which has been shown to give additional overall health benefits compared to indoor exercise
Good news thank you
If nobody's told you this yet today, you're the f*in man. Great video and always appreciated.
Would love a video on folks with one kidney. My aunt is starting her fitness/nutrition journey, and I’m trying to help her. I told her she needs to just focus on hitting protein (.7 to 1g per lb of goal body weight) for now and we will adjust from there. Her goal weight is 180lbs… And the kicker is she only has one kidney so she is leery of taking in too much protein. I’m no expert, and I’m sure her doctor is pushing low protein. Help!!
Love this science stuff. For the algo!
What plant protein would you suggest? And what brand?
Legumes (soy [preferably soy milk, tofu, natto], chickpeas, beans, lentils, etc.). Bob's Red brand has a high protein oat variety that has as much protein as chickpeas do naturally.
Getting it from those is probably healthier than in powders. Tastier as well.
All protein comes from plants.
It has to be protein powder if you want to get +100g/day. Layne has a video on protein quality sources and there is a few plant protein sources there.
@@Eline_Meijer It does not. I get 190 grams of protein some days and I don't use protein powder and eat very little meat (only about 20 grams would be animal protein).
Ribeye steak.
Doctor Jason Fung recetly uploaded a video that contradicts the traditional belief that someone engaged in weight training needs 1.6 to 2 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight, as this is considered the optimal amount to repair micro-damage through protein synthesis. In contrast, a sedentary person typically requires just 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight. He explains that 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight is sufficient to build muscle and anything extra ingested protein turns to glucose and stored in the cells so body utilises even little amount of protein most effectively without having to take so much protein
Given the amount of contrary research that is out there on that subject and Fung's general unreliability as a source, I'm highly skeptical of that claim.
@strategicsage7694 me too but plz watch that video he explains with referencing studies supporting it
I find when I sweat heavily, my clothes stink of ammonia
Is this normal and anything to worry about?
About reverse causality- there might not be a link that makes people with healthy kidneys eat more protein, but could there be a link whereby people with less healthy kidneys eat less protein (perhaps because it makes them feel unwell)?
I mean, if person's kidneys are damaged, body needs to repair them with something. That's one way how high protein intake might have protective effect.
@@0TheLastLoneWolf I know that kidneys don't repair as liver does, but they do at some capacity. If protein facilitates repair at just a bit higher rate, than rate at which ammonia damaging kidneys, then overall effect is positive.
Nephrologist love saying this.
It would be interesting if healthy kidneys somehow actually did have a linkage with the brain to cause high protein diets. Of course, this not at all what the scientific findings are saying, as explained in the video. But imagine if the health of the organs controlled the desire for the types of food consumed.
Some people notice that they have protein in their urine with a high protein diet. So i dont know if that means the kidneys can not handle that much protein or if its damaging over time. Some doctors and studies look at blood work to test kidney function. Anybody notice this? I think its called proteinuria
Most people don’t consume enough protein.
If your kidneys are healthy don’t worry about it.
If your kidneys are not healthy then consult a doctor.
-
I would imagine that everyone (healthy) can handle 150g protein everyday
whereas 300 and 600g protein is very individually independent.
Algo to the rythm
I think it depends on the type of protein and overall diet and hygiene. Think about this if amonia is up and toxins are up and cholesterol is up and antioxidants are down etc then would it not make sense that it would? I started eating About 250 grams and I was doing great until I ate 6 pounds of hamburger because I wanted cheap l carnitine. It wrecked me for several days. Well hamburger meat is not really that clean it’s highly processed and full of bad fat. Point is all protein is not the same.
Commmet 4 the algorithm!
How about mild kidney disease and higher protien.
I'm curious if it's at leaset partially a socioeconomic issue, as in poor people can't afford to buy higher quantities of protein. The other issue I could see is, I would assume people eating higher protein diets are also more likely to be exercising regularly.
Even people, who are in kidney faillure and need hemodialysis, are on a high protein diet subsribed by their docters
Here’s one for the kidney bean algorithm.
Any good data on people with single kidney?
I donated a kidney last year and wondered the same. The nephrologists will generally tell you to avoid high protein diets. I don’t like to ignore the professionals and have adjusted my protein intake downward toward 1.6 g per kg or 120 grams at 185lbs bodyweight (age 70). They would have preferred around 80 grams. Their rationale was ialthough current studies don’t show a negative effect, a single kidney.is working twice as hard to process the higher nitrogen load. I appreciate their honesty but believe they are still compelled to recommend the standard guideline to avoid legal repercussions from deviating from the norm. A nephrologist is only concerned about the kidneys, not the total human physiology. Each of us has the responsibility of balancing the various systems in our bodies to optimize overall health, for me that includes healthy muscle support.
@kurplop357 thanks for response. I was born with a single kidney so different situation. What I have read is that donors of kidneys may not be bad because in order to be able to donate you need to be very healthy. There was a recent study showing that people born with one kidney do have impaired late life health. And that studies showing no bad effect had all been on healthy donors.
Either way, knowing protein and as you say, is the negative impact on kidney worth the benefits to rest of body.
There is also treatments and technology that may change the kidney game in 10 20 years for people like you and me
@@bobbybrown1258 Good point. I was assuming a perfectly functioning kidney. Any propensity toward kidney disease, either genetic or compromised by past bad practices, should make one more cautious.
thx🙂
And what "healthy kidney" means exactly?
If I eat over 140 g of protein a day I will pee five times during the night, it doesn't happen if I don't eat the protein and I've been tested and there's no protein in my urine so I have no idea
@Layne I know how much of a fan you are of the carnivore diet. LOL
However, my 70 year old mother was stage 4 renal failure a few years ago. She started eating only steak and eggs and within 6 months no longer was in failure. In fact after almost 3 years of eating this way, her labs indicated that she is 86+% kidney function and no longer needs to see her nephrologist. Not a "human randomized control trial". But we are fine with that.
The plural of anecdotes is not data
@@Greg_Chock no. But an anecdote might be a starting point for "here's something interesting, let's investigate deeper."
Wow cool story. One time I cut my leg, then I started smoking cigarettes. A week later I was magically healed ! Clearly cigarettes having healing powers.
@@Baysha1000 Sure! But I'm not going to suggest lifestyle changes until something more rigorous is done
@@Greg_Chock Show me where I suggested lifestyle changes, I will wait... I simply reported that in my mother's experience. A damaged kidney was not further damaged by eating protein, and in fact the opposite was true. What's interesting, is that she's not alone. There are others that have reported the same.
protein & homocysteine?
5:58 I'm 63kg (around 140 pounds), and I've been eating 180-200g of protein for the last 20 so years. My kidneys are perfectly fine
For the algorithm!
This one's for you, algorithm 😉🖖🏻
Do we believe a guy who ends the video with an ad for his own ultra processed high protein product, or all the kidney physicians who shy away from high protein diets? Anyone can say anything on TH-cam to make sales, with no consequences if someone out there then follows that advice and gets ill down the line.
Who’s this algorithm fella?
Depends on your genetics. Nice simplistic approach. Maybe crush plates and leave science to more tech savvy humans
1.5 speed was designed for vids like this
Do kidney stones count as kidney disease?
no.
FTA 😊
Sending Al Gore rhythm some ❤
It is the Carbs and Sugar bro! We've been eating meat for MILLIONS of years!
“The dose makes the poison.”
1.3grams is not high (actually its low) compared to what most bodybuilders and weightmen take. So for them this study has little to no value.
As someone who sells protein powder, I going to go ahead and ignore your take on this topic.
Yeah, no answer to the question in the title
🎉🎉🎉
FTA
Four thee Al Gore rhythm!!
💪🏽
hmmm, I thought protein was bad for your liver.
For the human RANDOMIIIIZED control comments
For the algorithm
The connection is that people that eat more protein get satisfied and don’t eat as many carbs and sugars which can cause more kidney damage
I'm a kidney donor. Having only one kidney, I get routine kidney checkups.
Within the last year, I started body building. My last screening freaked my Dr out so bad that she immediately scheduled me for screenings, and visits with a specialist etc.
This obviously freaked me out a bit, however I started reading peer reviewed studies on body builders and creatine supplements and how they can produce false, low kidney filtration quality.
It sounds like many Drs are still not considered muscle mass when performing this test, which is critical. And some Drs are still demonizing creatine supplements.
I haven't had my formal follow up exams, but I'm confident this will be a good conversation starter for increased muscle mass having a "false negative" effect on these screenings
I’m a donor also. My creatinine levels were high before I donated. The doctors quickly wrote that off as a result of muscle mass. My 24 hour tests came back showing kidney function more than twice the eGFR based on creatinine serum level. It becomes the new baseline for evaluating kidney function. High protein in the blood is usually caused by a high protein diet and muscle turnover in athletes. High levels of proteins in urine can be a reason for concern.
Comment for Algo
💪🏿💪🏿
He looks like Ben Affleck if he gave up smoking.
Al
“HUMAN RANDOMIZED CONTROL TRIALS” cracks me up every time 🤣🤣🤣
That's why I have kid knee disease. Here I thought it was from bouncing my kid on my knee too much.
❤❤👍👍👍
For the Algorithuzz
fta
Some people eat like 20 grams of protein per kg. Can't be be good
Antidotally speaking, I remember feeling the kidney pains when I was eating high protein while body building on a lacto-ovo vegetarian diet with whey protein shakes, and a couple times I actually smelled the ammonia on my breath!
" leave a comment for the algorithm" not because he believes in feedback or critique
Wait until RFK JR goes after seed/vegetable oils and your whole team has to walk back everything you said saying seed oils aren’t bad 😅
My husband had normal blood work until he went pure carnivore... his kidney function numbers were really bad due to the high protein diet...
How do you know its the protein intake? Pure carvinore could mean lots of other changes, like high saturated fats, lack of fiber, and certain micronutrient shifts.
Based on which tests? Blood work ? GFR? Creatinine? Urine test? Because the kidney disease is a very slow process
Carnivore is more than just high protein. Besides eating 90+ percent meat is not just high protein, it's insanely high protein. My doc is very pleased with my blood test and I've been getting 1.5-2 g per kg bodyweight for years. But I do eat my veggies too and lots of dairy
Al Gore Rhythm
HUMAN RANDOMIZED CONTROLLED TRIALS!!