Another great discussion. Still awaiting my ASHP installation which takes place next month, but used the info gathered from previous discussions to push for an ASHP which will meet my needs easily for 350 days a year and accept that possibly, on the other days I may need a little supplementary heating. Love the discussions and the debate that ensues!.
HYBRID HEAT PUMP - Series or Parallel. Excellent video. I am glad that you have taken the time to explore this subject I am wrestling with what to do about my relatively new Wocester Bosch Regular Ri boiler in a house with lots of solar and batteries, and existing cylinder with hot water from excess solar most of the year. I am coming down to the Daikin Hybrid system as my prefered option. To keep the instal cost and hence total cost of ownership ROI good I had been considering this working as heat pump in parallel with existing boiler, much as you discussed in video with the boiler there as a "back up" for really cold period. Daiken describe their instal for existing boiler as fairly simple with a couple of non return valves on boiler and heat pump to prevent problems. The alternative way would be to also have their Daikin boiler, in which case it works in series with the flow of heat pump going to return of boiler and either straight through the boiler or getting further heat before entering the flow to emitters (radiators). Now by adding the new boiler and associated work ruins the ROI for the project. I have the Worcester still under warranty but havent asked them if it would affect warranty by adding heat pump. Perhaps by adding the heat pump will make the boiler last longer. Lots of things to consider. Be good to get your thoughts.
I have a different reason for thinking I need two systems. I have an aging oil boiler. Why change yet. Wait until I have problems. Then it gets urgent. An easy option is to replace it with another oil boiler.. Why can I not get a grant for the heat pump then remove the oil boiler at a later date... Belt and braces. A friend who replaced the gas boiler with a heat pump. Retained gas fire for power cuts. To save the standard charge it's fed from gas bottles. The pipe gas was removed.
@caterthun4853 it may be worth doing some preparation for am ASHP while your boiler is still working. Think about any additional insulation, your electric supply to property, planning, etc. Also think about any sytem changes required, larger radiators, and pipework. Rearly the same as just bolting a new boiler as we've recently found out.
@mackay250 more of a cost benefit analysis. You could design a system that does that, but you would need radiators and a ASHP which was way oversized than required for the other 355 days. Ours was worked on a design of -2. It's possible that on a few days a year we may need supplementary heating....but I doubt it will be that often.
From a carbon point of view, a hybrid system is NOT the way to go. It means that the highest heating load would be produced by burning gas, and the heat pump would only eliminate the much smaller heat loads in Spring & Autumn. Also, the financial grant is not available for hybrid systems, only for 'pure' heat pump systems.
I appreciate your comment. As I tried to allude in the video, I see a potential case for a hybrid system if the boiler were only used for the heaviest lifting during extreme cold when heat pumps can become less efficient. In such scenarios, a boiler might help bridge the gap without overburdening the system. That said, I completely understand and agree with your point about the carbon implications. Relying on a boiler for peak demand does mean that the highest heating loads are met with fossil fuels, which runs counter to the goal of reducing emissions.
True but it could be an easy low risk to the consumer step. There is no risk that it can be worst than your existing system because you have your existing system. The HP can only make things better. If you stuck a HP in parallel with a boiler then the boiler can do the extremes. If after a few years it turns out it's rarely used it can be removed or replaced with another smaller HP. Then you have system with better capacity and modulation.
Why is everyone obsessed with COP? Just rtun it inefficiently when it's really cold. Just narrow the price betwwen gas and electricity and people will convert in droves.
Well read item from the sponsor following your eyes while reading what grant wanted you to say , would be nice if you spent a little time talking about a UK manufacturer of heat pumps = Ebac , it would also be nice if you spent some time talking about ATA systems be it good bad or indifferent, who also be nice to have a panel to have a debate of the benefits or not between ATA and ATW , having watched a video where the person explained with ATA and the system he has no need to have a water boiler at all . As usual I won’t get a reply = that’s fine = be who you want to be not what others want you to be .
As I’ve mentioned before, we covered A2A systems in this episode: th-cam.com/video/aOblNpj2wag/w-d-xo.html. Our primary audience is UK homeowners, where demand for A2A systems remains quite limited. For this reason, we focus on topics that resonate with a broader audience. Regarding Ebac, I’ve reached out to them previously but never received a response. It’s difficult to spotlight a company that hasn’t shown any interest in participating in our podcast.
Another great discussion. Still awaiting my ASHP installation which takes place next month, but used the info gathered from previous discussions to push for an ASHP which will meet my needs easily for 350 days a year and accept that possibly, on the other days I may need a little supplementary heating. Love the discussions and the debate that ensues!.
Thanks for your continued support and for watching. Sounds like you’re definitely going about it the right way!
HYBRID HEAT PUMP - Series or Parallel.
Excellent video. I am glad that you have taken the time to explore this subject
I am wrestling with what to do about my relatively new Wocester Bosch Regular Ri boiler in a house with lots of solar and batteries, and existing cylinder with hot water from excess solar most of the year. I am coming down to the Daikin Hybrid system as my prefered option. To keep the instal cost and hence total cost of ownership ROI good I had been considering this working as heat pump in parallel with existing boiler, much as you discussed in video with the boiler there as a "back up" for really cold period. Daiken describe their instal for existing boiler as fairly simple with a couple of non return valves on boiler and heat pump to prevent problems. The alternative way would be to also have their Daikin boiler, in which case it works in series with the flow of heat pump going to return of boiler and either straight through the boiler or getting further heat before entering the flow to emitters (radiators). Now by adding the new boiler and associated work ruins the ROI for the project. I have the Worcester still under warranty but havent asked them if it would affect warranty by adding heat pump. Perhaps by adding the heat pump will make the boiler last longer. Lots of things to consider. Be good to get your thoughts.
Another really insightful episode. 👍
I have a different reason for thinking I need two systems. I have an aging oil boiler. Why change yet. Wait until I have problems. Then it gets urgent. An easy option is to replace it with another oil boiler.. Why can I not get a grant for the heat pump then remove the oil boiler at a later date... Belt and braces.
A friend who replaced the gas boiler with a heat pump. Retained gas fire for power cuts. To save the standard charge it's fed from gas bottles. The pipe gas was removed.
@caterthun4853 it may be worth doing some preparation for am ASHP while your boiler is still working. Think about any additional insulation, your electric supply to property, planning, etc. Also think about any sytem changes required, larger radiators, and pipework. Rearly the same as just bolting a new boiler as we've recently found out.
Why do they design most heat pumps to -1.8c? Why not design them to -10c or lower? My boiler can heat my house easy at -10 or -15 probably.
The design temperature for heat pumps is typically based on the average lowest ambient temperature for your specific geographical location.
@mackay250 more of a cost benefit analysis. You could design a system that does that, but you would need radiators and a ASHP which was way oversized than required for the other 355 days. Ours was worked on a design of -2. It's possible that on a few days a year we may need supplementary heating....but I doubt it will be that often.
From a carbon point of view, a hybrid system is NOT the way to go. It means that the highest heating load would be produced by burning gas, and the heat pump would only eliminate the much smaller heat loads in Spring & Autumn.
Also, the financial grant is not available for hybrid systems, only for 'pure' heat pump systems.
I appreciate your comment. As I tried to allude in the video, I see a potential case for a hybrid system if the boiler were only used for the heaviest lifting during extreme cold when heat pumps can become less efficient. In such scenarios, a boiler might help bridge the gap without overburdening the system.
That said, I completely understand and agree with your point about the carbon implications. Relying on a boiler for peak demand does mean that the highest heating loads are met with fossil fuels, which runs counter to the goal of reducing emissions.
True but it could be an easy low risk to the consumer step. There is no risk that it can be worst than your existing system because you have your existing system. The HP can only make things better. If you stuck a HP in parallel with a boiler then the boiler can do the extremes. If after a few years it turns out it's rarely used it can be removed or replaced with another smaller HP. Then you have system with better capacity and modulation.
Why is everyone obsessed with COP? Just rtun it inefficiently when it's really cold. Just narrow the price betwwen gas and electricity and people will convert in droves.
Well read item from the sponsor following your eyes while reading what grant wanted you to say , would be nice if you spent a little time talking about a UK manufacturer of heat pumps = Ebac , it would also be nice if you spent some time talking about ATA systems be it good bad or indifferent, who also be nice to have a panel to have a debate of the benefits or not between ATA and ATW , having watched a video where the person explained with ATA and the system he has no need to have a water boiler at all . As usual I won’t get a reply = that’s fine = be who you want to be not what others want you to be .
As I’ve mentioned before, we covered A2A systems in this episode: th-cam.com/video/aOblNpj2wag/w-d-xo.html.
Our primary audience is UK homeowners, where demand for A2A systems remains quite limited. For this reason, we focus on topics that resonate with a broader audience.
Regarding Ebac, I’ve reached out to them previously but never received a response. It’s difficult to spotlight a company that hasn’t shown any interest in participating in our podcast.