Miriam didn't start out asking Rinder for answers about his role, she just wanted a document that was mentioned on the Aftermath TV show, and he got weird (first no answer, then accusatory), after that she started questioning how he contributed to her abuse.
The letter also specifically states that in any coverage they want the letter shared in it’s entirety. The letter is awful and makes them look horrible, but they WANT it shared. Very odd. They certainly made things worse, and they look really bad.
Thanks for addressing this.. Miriam's story is devastating. Mike Rinder could take the Cult of Scientology down in a heart beat, due to all that he knows. I imagine the problem is, he is afraid that it could also cause his own downfall, in some way? I wish he would man up and take the plunge. To take down Scientology would mean saving thousands and likely millions of lives. The depth of their corrupt reach is stunning. He has definitely been spending years in helping to expose Scientology. That is great. But I sure wish the whole game could just end. There is an army of people out here who would help and support Mike should he ever decide to make that plunge.
Word is that Mike had plenty of documents he took with him that would bring down Scientology, but he won't use them unless he is given full immunity. Even with that, he will look like scum
I made a comment on one of Mark Headly's live chats while he had Mike Rinder on his stream. I commented I was happy to see Mike Rinder exposing $cientology and I stated that this will help Mike make up for some of the rotten things he did while he was in OSA. Mark Headly seemed to be offended by my comment and he arrogantly said, "Well, I don't know what he has to make up for." Since that day, I pretty much stopped watching Headly's content. It really left a bad taste in my mouth. But we also have to remember, these people pretty much grew up in the cult and they were among the MOST indoctrinated. These tactics are all they know and it will take MANY YEARS for some of them to stop acting like that. Some may never stop because it's all they know. I think Aaron Levin-Smith is an exception. He really seems very down to earth and he seems to be his own man. I sense NO culty behavior from Aaron. Anyways, people need to remember that Mike was the head of OSA. OSA does some HORRIBLE things to people and they used to be MUCH worse back in the day while before and while Mike was in charge. Many things they have done is outright criminal. But in their mind, they were "saving the planet". That's what $cientology made them to believe.
The AFoundation is an Echo Chamber that really needs at least 2 never ins and no married couple for balance , to reign in the cult think and give them the real world perspective. They were all top echelon members , so basically " Partners in Crime" they're covering each other's ass . Emotions cloud judgement and Mark definitely got over emotional .
Mike, Claire and Amy never stop telling viewers how vitally important they were in COS. They are like Al Bundy forever reliving the glory days of that one football game from high school. They've never truly left Scientology behind, crave the power they had, crave the fear they fed on from others and I feel sorry for their children.
@@danaeads919 True 😂 It's sad that they give any value to being partners in crime with savage Miscavage. That's literally what 4 of the AF Board members were .
The ball has started rolling for the Aftermath Foundation. Usually, once this happens, the ball continues to roll, gather speed until it crashes, destroying itself! I too have been following this mess. I believe the Aftermath Foundation is or will be finished, such is the culture we live in. The internet is very powerful. People do have enough power to built up to extreme heights people/organisations. They also have the power to cancel/destroy the same.
Thanks so much for this clear and to the point vlog. I've seen post about Rinder all over youtube but they all either talk about things like I've been keeping up with everything or they do 10-20 min intros covering their own audience. As an outside with a token interest in Scientologty (what else is there to reveal at this point unless Misgivers wife comes back from the grace?) it's a relief to finally get an update without having to wade through chatter to find out wtf is going on! Thanks!
Rinder & the Headleys should resign from the foundation. Too much of a conflict of interest. Their OSA attitudes & behavior has never changed. They’re disgusting!
In pure COS behavior, he is working overtime to destroy all the goodwill he had previously built up. He (and Marc, Claire, Amy, Mat, and Kristie) were jealous of Aaron's success and chose to kick him (and Luis) out of the AF to crush him. They failed. Mike is again trying to crush someone and he has failed again.
What they did after the Civil War was to pass the Insurrection Act. Anybody who took part in an insurrection against the government was denied the ability to hold office. COS management should be encouraged to leave, provided funds to start over, but they need to be transparent about their actions while in the cult. Even that, I would suggest, is not enough to allow them to hold office in any post-Scientology group. Let others, without such dirty hands, take those reins.
Mike Rinder, an individual, was asked questions. He had no obligation to answer them even though most feel as the head of OSA he knew what had happened to Mirriam. The most bizarre part of this situation is that Mike Rinder had an attorney for the Aftermath Foundation respond. Why involve the Aftermath Foundation at all? Finally, I would never retain an attorney who would send the fleas and the dog insults!
@@marilynrebouche719I think they could get around that because of the mentioning of the Foundation in one of the questions. Marilyn Honig and Poe on the Go got into that in their latest live. And it might be that Rinder saw that particular question as an opportunity to distance himself from ALL of the questions: focus on that question - and make it all about the foundation, not him. That way they could be seen as an attack on the FOUNDATION - and not on him personally.
Have ANY of these people received GOOD therapy frm an actual psychiatrist? I get itbthat the CULT said therapy is bad wrong bc omfg,nthen people might be able to heal and think for themselves! Ive u followed the who,e mit snd caboodle. Every damn ex Scn seems mentally unhealthy/dysfunctional/addicted etc etc. Without therapy they cannot heal. p.s. re: Rabbit. I find it irresponsible of her to term herself a counselor. A social worker has no counseling degree, no counseling license, which is REQUIRED in every state in order to be a counselor A social worker is NOT a counselor. She doesnt have the expertise she pretends to have. Another youtube ego run amok, eh. Theyre everywhere.
It seems pretty likely that during his time at OSA Mike has Ben involved in some pretty distasteful stuff. I, like most people had hope that he had redeemed himself but it appears that old habits are hard to break.
This was SA abuse by Mirriam’s father. She wanted the answers to help with her case against him. Rinder did not need to bring in the foundation lawyer. The letter was not addressed to or mentioned the foundation This is Rinder bringing the foundation into the situation and employing his OSA techniques. All he had to do was personally respond and say he wasn’t going to respond to the questions. Period. Personally, I think Rinder should be subpoenaed as part of Mirriam’s lawsuit.
Mike can't separate himself from the foundation, the same way he couldn't separate himself from CoS. He has never broken the cult mentality, just switched allegiances, and kept up the same behaviors.
I think this is very likely. Mike had a lifetime of cult conditioning, and that's a very difficult thing to shake. He's just replaced "the church" with "the foundation"
I like your objective and logical approach, Graham! You should really keep doing this, whatever the subject matter. I've subscribed, and look forward to hearing more from you!
I haven't watched Rabbit's videos: they are pretty long. But as far as Mike Rinder goes, someone can be taken out of Scientology, but sometimes the Scientology just can't be taken out of the person.
Exactly. You're referring to AAron right? Because coming from someone who's actually watched and followed the ex movement since the early aughts and isn't taken in by AArons clickbate and miniscule TH-cam fame.
Just one clarification about The Aftermath Foundation: Mike Rinder is listed as a "Board Member." He has no other title. Claire Headley is the President of the foundation.
They are saying Aaron is the dog and since hes been on the down the rabbit hole they are saying that she will get fleas. I cant believe hiw no one gets it. I like Aaron and rabbit. I dont like Rinder.
TBF, Rinder is on the board of the Aftermath Foundation, but Claire Headly is the president. It does appear, though, that Rinder is pulling all the strings.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. I work from home, so I can listen to this stuff all day if I want to. I know not everyone has that luxury. Thanks for the encouragement.
Here the scary sad part of this these people who get drawn into this so-called religion don’t understand or would ever believe that the leader and its wife are demons or nephilim.
Why is Mike Rinder working with a scientology laywer or a former one? Mikes letter from his laywer's has that laywer's name and email on leaked scientology files...
After reading Mike’s book, i started to feel he wasn’t anti scientoloy. He’s anti david miscavige. He still is so proud of the work he did there and the power he felt there. He just thinks he should’ve taken over when lrh died. Not miscavige
COMMENT CONTINUED: ...to take down COS would mean saving thousands, likely millions of lives....their corrupt, abusive reach is stunning. Mike has spent years doing great work trying to expose Scientology. I don't discount that. He is to be commended. But....I sure wish we could finally just end the game. I think Mike could do it, and he would have an army of support.
It's a tough situation. These are people with decades of cult conditioning. It's gonna be hard to shake those habits of thought. Exactly why there needs to be a few never-ins on the board.
Unfortunately the COS reprograms their people to be void of reaction or response in a compassionate way . This is started with what they call bullbating, it continues with constant cues to keep your emotions unavailable . Mike should have called Miriam to validate her pain and say i understand why you wrote what you did. How can i help you resolve these issues .. It didn't need to go public ,but left with no choice cuz Mike dug his heals in attack mode rather than get the affidavit she needed he further exacerbated her trauma .
Yes, Mike is the one that escalated the situation and caused Mirrium to feel threatened. The 12 questions would never had been asked had he just sent her the affidavit in the first place
And, CH was up there w the rest. She, too, was harmed, remains harmed, remains unwell. IMO. P.S. as does ASL, as do all who havent sought consistent therapy where they are honest and working at healing. For years. Bc that is what it takes. It takes what it takes.
Way too much is being made of the dogs and fleas comment… I see it as an ‘Australainism’ - it’s not an uncommon saying in Australia (which is where Rinder is from). It’s not a big deal, and not to be taken as an insult. All I think he was probably trying to say is he didn’t want to be answering these sort of questions from a youtuber who he doesn’t know. Rinder could have just said that, and that many of the questions rely on premises which he doesn’t accept. He made the mistake of getting a lawyer involved in writing the letter - sure take the advice of a lawyer but he should have penned a short and simple letter setting out his position, and not include dogs/fleas comment (that people are hyperventilating about). I don’t really like the pile on happening on Mike Rinder - he’s not a bad guy. And ASL is also a good guy… they should both just move on.
Yeah if you have a spare 10hrs/day, listening to a barely audible, long winded “shout out to a hair brush,” -you know who you are! (Ex: Incidents-that’s it! That’s the plural! Singular would be w/o an “s!”Come on people! At least ACT like you’ve been somewhere. Just bc ppl have crappy parents doesn’t make it MY fault. It’s truly absurd.
Miriam didn't start out asking Rinder for answers about his role, she just wanted a document that was mentioned on the Aftermath TV show, and he got weird (first no answer, then accusatory), after that she started questioning how he contributed to her abuse.
She was a not just a young person, she was a toddler!
This matters to me most in that they left him out there.
The letter also specifically states that in any coverage they want the letter shared in it’s entirety. The letter is awful and makes them look horrible, but they WANT it shared. Very odd. They certainly made things worse, and they look really bad.
Agree!
My wife and I donated money to the AF and I regret it. These people are nothing more than “Scientology Light”
Thanks for addressing this.. Miriam's story is devastating.
Mike Rinder could take the Cult of Scientology down in a heart beat, due to all that he knows.
I imagine the problem is, he is afraid that it could also cause his own downfall, in some way?
I wish he would man up and take the plunge. To take down Scientology would mean saving
thousands and likely millions of lives. The depth of their corrupt reach is stunning.
He has definitely been spending years in helping to expose Scientology. That is great.
But I sure wish the whole game could just end.
There is an army of people out here who would help and support Mike should he ever decide to
make that plunge.
Word is that Mike had plenty of documents he took with him that would bring down Scientology, but he won't use them unless he is given full immunity. Even with that, he will look like scum
I made a comment on one of Mark Headly's live chats while he had Mike Rinder on his stream. I commented I was happy to see Mike Rinder exposing $cientology and I stated that this will help Mike make up for some of the rotten things he did while he was in OSA. Mark Headly seemed to be offended by my comment and he arrogantly said, "Well, I don't know what he has to make up for."
Since that day, I pretty much stopped watching Headly's content. It really left a bad taste in my mouth.
But we also have to remember, these people pretty much grew up in the cult and they were among the MOST indoctrinated. These tactics are all they know and it will take MANY YEARS for some of them to stop acting like that. Some may never stop because it's all they know.
I think Aaron Levin-Smith is an exception. He really seems very down to earth and he seems to be his own man. I sense NO culty behavior from Aaron.
Anyways, people need to remember that Mike was the head of OSA. OSA does some HORRIBLE things to people and they used to be MUCH worse back in the day while before and while Mike was in charge. Many things they have done is outright criminal. But in their mind, they were "saving the planet". That's what $cientology made them to believe.
The AFoundation is an Echo Chamber that really needs at least 2 never ins and no married couple for balance , to reign in the cult think and give them the real world perspective. They were all top echelon members , so basically " Partners in Crime" they're covering each other's ass .
Emotions cloud judgement and Mark definitely got over emotional .
Mike, Claire and Amy never stop telling viewers how vitally important they were in COS. They are like Al Bundy forever reliving the glory days of that one football game from high school. They've never truly left Scientology behind, crave the power they had, crave the fear they fed on from others and I feel sorry for their children.
@@danaeads919
True 😂
It's sad that they give any value to being partners in crime with savage Miscavage.
That's literally what 4 of the AF Board members were .
Mark Carry's Mike's water
You're talking about this channel? My channel? I only delete comments if they're personally insulting.
The ball has started rolling for the Aftermath Foundation. Usually, once this happens, the ball continues to roll, gather speed until it crashes, destroying itself! I too have been following this mess. I believe the Aftermath Foundation is or will be finished, such is the culture we live in. The internet is very powerful. People do have enough power to built up to extreme heights people/organisations. They also have the power to cancel/destroy the same.
Shame. they snatched it from Aaron just to plow it into the dirt. Highly sus.
My question would be why did he not just send the affidavit she needed for her case!
I don't believe they tossed it after no one sued them after a year. That's not what you do with that type of impt. legal doc!
Exactly!!! He is paranoid!
Thanks so much for this clear and to the point vlog. I've seen post about Rinder all over youtube but they all either talk about things like I've been keeping up with everything or they do 10-20 min intros covering their own audience. As an outside with a token interest in Scientologty (what else is there to reveal at this point unless Misgivers wife comes back from the grace?) it's a relief to finally get an update without having to wade through chatter to find out wtf is going on! Thanks!
Almost as if they are trying to destroy the AF.
Rinder & the Headleys should resign from the foundation. Too much of a conflict of interest. Their OSA attitudes & behavior has never changed. They’re disgusting!
MR could probably get full legal immunity but his part in it all would destroy his reputation.
In pure COS behavior, he is working overtime to destroy all the goodwill he had previously built up. He (and Marc, Claire, Amy, Mat, and Kristie) were jealous of Aaron's success and chose to kick him (and Luis) out of the AF to crush him. They failed. Mike is again trying to crush someone and he has failed again.
He likely already has immunity.
Why is mike being such a douche about all this..? I really liked him before he screwed aaron😊
What they did after the Civil War was to pass the Insurrection Act. Anybody who took part in an insurrection against the government was denied the ability to hold office. COS management should be encouraged to leave, provided funds to start over, but they need to be transparent about their actions while in the cult.
Even that, I would suggest, is not enough to allow them to hold office in any post-Scientology group. Let others, without such dirty hands, take those reins.
Mike Rinder, an individual, was asked questions. He had no obligation to answer them even though most feel as the head of OSA he knew what had happened to Mirriam. The most bizarre part of this situation is that Mike Rinder had an attorney for the Aftermath Foundation respond. Why involve the Aftermath Foundation at all? Finally, I would never retain an attorney who would send the fleas and the dog insults!
Exactly!
Using AF funds to pay for Mikes personal issues is not legal with a non-profit organization. Just sayin
@@marilynrebouche719I think they could get around that because of the mentioning of the Foundation in one of the questions. Marilyn Honig and Poe on the Go got into that in their latest live.
And it might be that Rinder saw that particular question as an opportunity to distance himself from ALL of the questions: focus on that question - and make it all about the foundation, not him. That way they could be seen as an attack on the FOUNDATION - and not on him personally.
Have ANY of these people received GOOD therapy frm an actual psychiatrist? I get itbthat the CULT said therapy is bad wrong bc omfg,nthen people might be able to heal and think for themselves! Ive u followed the who,e mit snd caboodle. Every damn ex Scn seems mentally unhealthy/dysfunctional/addicted etc etc. Without therapy they cannot heal.
p.s. re: Rabbit. I find it irresponsible of her to term herself a counselor. A social worker has no counseling degree, no counseling license, which is REQUIRED in every state in order to be a counselor A social worker is NOT a counselor. She doesnt have the expertise she pretends to have. Another youtube ego run amok, eh. Theyre everywhere.
Search Rinder's net worth online. $35,000,000 it says but does praise him for his attacks on scn. Hmmm, seems he has made a lot of money doing that.
Mark Rinder is a coward
Excellent summary of the situation, thank you.
It seems pretty likely that during his time at OSA Mike has Ben involved in some pretty distasteful stuff. I, like most people had hope that he had redeemed himself but it appears that old habits are hard to break.
Not likely!
For sure He was involved!
This was SA abuse by Mirriam’s father. She wanted the answers to help with her case against him. Rinder did not need to bring in the foundation lawyer. The letter was not addressed to or mentioned the foundation This is Rinder bringing the foundation into the situation and employing his OSA techniques. All he had to do was personally respond and say he wasn’t going to respond to the questions. Period. Personally, I think Rinder should be subpoenaed as part of Mirriam’s lawsuit.
Mike can't separate himself from the foundation, the same way he couldn't separate himself from CoS. He has never broken the cult mentality, just switched allegiances, and kept up the same behaviors.
I think this is very likely. Mike had a lifetime of cult conditioning, and that's a very difficult thing to shake. He's just replaced "the church" with "the foundation"
You just a new fan here. Thank You very much for your content. 💖💓💖
Welcome!
I like your objective and logical approach, Graham! You should really keep doing this, whatever the subject matter.
I've subscribed, and look forward to hearing more from you!
Awesome, thank you!
I haven't watched Rabbit's videos: they are pretty long. But as far as Mike Rinder goes, someone can be taken out of Scientology, but sometimes the Scientology just can't be taken out of the person.
Exactly. You're referring to AAron right? Because coming from someone who's actually watched and followed the ex movement since the early aughts and isn't taken in by AArons clickbate and miniscule TH-cam fame.
@StevenWilliams0302 Mmm....no. You seem personally offended. What's that about?
@@SoCali_Surfer critical thinking is seriously lacking in this comment section. So yeah I'm "offended" by stupidity.
@StevenWilliams0302 Then don't read them!
@@StevenWilliams0302your aggression is unnecessary and super sus.
Just one clarification about The Aftermath Foundation: Mike Rinder is listed as a "Board Member." He has no other title. Claire Headley is the President of the foundation.
Quite right! Thank you!
Thanks for the explanation. I certainly have been wondering wtf 🤷♀️ is going on. You have good content. I’ve caught u several times
Hey, thanks! Glad you like my low-effort ramblings!
Great job on this Graham
Thanks!
The insult was vey bizarre
They are saying Aaron is the dog and since hes been on the down the rabbit hole they are saying that she will get fleas. I cant believe hiw no one gets it. I like Aaron and rabbit. I dont like Rinder.
I don't believe Aaron was mentioned in the questions.
TBF, Rinder is on the board of the Aftermath Foundation, but Claire Headly is the president. It does appear, though, that Rinder is pulling all the strings.
Nice summary. Keep making similar "reports" as many of us can't listen to all the hours of videos covering these "disputed" episodes.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. I work from home, so I can listen to this stuff all day if I want to. I know not everyone has that luxury. Thanks for the encouragement.
Thanks for the information.
Here the scary sad part of this these people who get drawn into this so-called religion don’t understand or would ever believe that the leader and its wife are demons or nephilim.
This is more addressing the generations born in and how they were treated. And then in getting out were forced todeal with their abusers.
New Subscriber 🙋♀️🇬🇧
Yay! Thank you!
Why is Mike Rinder working with a scientology laywer or a former one? Mikes letter from his laywer's has that laywer's name and email on leaked scientology files...
After reading Mike’s book, i started to feel he wasn’t anti scientoloy. He’s anti david miscavige. He still is so proud of the work he did there and the power he felt there. He just thinks he should’ve taken over when lrh died. Not miscavige
COMMENT CONTINUED: ...to take down COS would mean saving thousands, likely millions of lives....their corrupt, abusive reach is stunning.
Mike has spent years doing great work trying to expose Scientology. I don't discount that. He is to be commended. But....I sure wish we could finally just
end the game. I think Mike could do it, and he would have an army of support.
Its like they started there own cult at the aftermath foundation
It's a tough situation. These are people with decades of cult conditioning. It's gonna be hard to shake those habits of thought. Exactly why there needs to be a few never-ins on the board.
Rinder showing his true colors. He is a narcissist and power monger.
Unfortunately the COS reprograms their people to be void of reaction or response in a compassionate way . This is started with what they call bullbating, it continues with constant cues to keep your emotions unavailable .
Mike should have called Miriam to validate her pain and say i understand why you wrote what you did. How can i help you resolve these issues .. It didn't need to go public ,but left with no choice cuz Mike dug his heals in attack mode rather than get the affidavit she needed he further exacerbated her trauma .
Yes, Mike is the one that escalated the situation and caused Mirrium to feel threatened. The 12 questions would never had been asked had he just sent her the affidavit in the first place
0:28 Not just according to her. Her father, the perpetrator of the SA have a 2 hour confession.
You must be factual with every detail!
Thanks, I didn't know that.
This is turning into a soap opera.
💫 Awesome 💫....🫂
Rinder isn’t the head of AF. Claire is the president. He just thinks he’s the star of this whole movement.
Quite right. I spoke carelessly.
And, CH was up there w the rest. She, too, was harmed, remains harmed, remains unwell. IMO. P.S. as does ASL, as do all who havent sought consistent therapy where they are honest and working at healing. For years. Bc that is what it takes. It takes what it takes.
I forgot to say that I enjoyed the video.
Its not pronounced OSA, it's osa, as if it's a word, nor an acronym
Correct...o sa
Way too much is being made of the dogs and fleas comment… I see it as an ‘Australainism’ - it’s not an uncommon saying in Australia (which is where Rinder is from). It’s not a big deal, and not to be taken as an insult. All I think he was probably trying to say is he didn’t want to be answering these sort of questions from a youtuber who he doesn’t know. Rinder could have just said that, and that many of the questions rely on premises which he doesn’t accept. He made the mistake of getting a lawyer involved in writing the letter - sure take the advice of a lawyer but he should have penned a short and simple letter setting out his position, and not include dogs/fleas comment (that people are hyperventilating about). I don’t really like the pile on happening on Mike Rinder - he’s not a bad guy. And ASL is also a good guy… they should both just move on.
✌
Yeah if you have a spare 10hrs/day, listening to a barely audible, long winded “shout out to a hair brush,” -you know who you are! (Ex: Incidents-that’s it! That’s the plural! Singular would be w/o an “s!”Come on people! At least ACT like you’ve been somewhere. Just bc ppl have crappy parents doesn’t make it MY fault. It’s truly absurd.
Is this supposed to make sense?
I know it's reaaaallllly tempting, but you really shouldn't comment when you've been drinking. :P