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Thanks for the post. I learned quite a lot. I have a question about starting up a roaster and the first batch. Is it important to let the roaster stay at charge temperature for a while so that all the metal parts achieve a sort of steady state or is it ok to put in the first batch as soon as the probes show that charge temperature has been reached? If it needs to stay at charge temperature for a whlie, then how do we decide that the ideal conditions for the first batch has been reached?

36:20 no... colour "intensity" would be the SATURATION of the colour... what I think you are getting at is, as you say, it's about a grey scale... A grey scale is only about luminocity... how bright or dark it is. So you are measuring degree of darkness, not intensity of colour.

This is very interesting... so if it's just time and temperature, there is NO such thing as "stalling"!? Ie, if you are roasting potatoes and the temp is held at 200 degrees, it will still be cooking, ie beans do not have to be subject to a/ ever increasing temperature b/ avoidance of "dips" and "flicks" c/ ever decreasing ROR... correct? Lordy what will Scott Rao have to say

interesting take

Thank you for this episode. It was clear and surprisingly simple and very helpful at the same time. It opened my eyes to get rid of destructive data during sensory evaluation (things im not really sure of). Much love from Poland

Thank you Coffee Academy for sharing such 0:24 comprehensive research ❤

I commend you on your stance. As a relatively new coffee roaster, 3500 roasts on my Huky and 285 on my Dietrich, (4 years) what you say makes complete sense. I’ve tried to follow the ROR dogma and wasn’t able to make it correlate with my out comes. As a small coffee roasting business I hope to take your intermediate/advanced coffee roast course to help me roast coffee better. Everything you say is on track with my experience as limited as it is. I don’t want to waist time and money on irrelevant theories want to roast the best coffee I can. Thank you. If you agree chime in, it i’s important to voice your voice your opinion even if you disagree with Morton. Roasting coffee isn’t cheap, so waiting time and money on “theories” and not science is a detriment. I will pick science every time. 🤜💥🤛

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📚🍒☕🙏🏿❤🔥

Hello. You said that shorter development time will give more fruity acidity and longer development time less fruity but more chocolaty. Do you think that the time to first crack will also influence acidity in the same way, I mean shorter time to first crack more acidity and later first crack less punchy acidity? Regards from Poland :)

Thank you. Fascinating. I got an earlybird Kickstarter IKAWA Home back in 2017 and have used it once or twice every week since. I confess to slipping into just pressing the button these days - using IKAWA's roast recipes. Watching this I'm tempted to get back into playing around with adjusting the recipes again.

Great interview Sam. Thank you.

I think you mentioned possibly doing a Kaffelogic roasting course. As a new owner of a Nucleus Link (basically same machine but different software) I would love that. For now, roasting is a passion and hobby, but there are plans to maybe specialize in a certain variety of coffee and have a small business of it.

This is great! I just started on your coffee science methodology podcast! You've done so much in the past two years. I can't wait to see what you will do next!

Hi Nicolai, thank you for the video! I am enjoying watching it, and am a happy owner of a Kaffelogic too. I am a complete discord beginner, and would love to join your/Kaffelogic forum. Do I need an invite to join the community? Cheers!

can you cover this with Kaleido M1/M2/M6 coffee roaster?

this is a really good talk, that was more objective and reasoned about coffee roasting very well!

Thank you Morten i am looking for e learning course and consultancy for my small business.

Great content! I'm a home roaster thinking of giving a go professionally. This information makes so much more logical sense to my scientific brain than all the other mumbo jumbo from internet "experts". A short development time not giving time for the heat to fully penetrate the bean giving a more acidic and complex flavor makes so much sense. Just like cooking a steak!

just wondering how fine you grind for your lighttells reading?

Finally! Somebody is making sense.

Took this course last year. Well worth it if you have a Bullet.

Looking forward to the remarks on the new SCA Cupping Protocol

We're all dancing around the name of Scott Rao.ROR is his baby,

This is is great!

This is great! As someone new to Roasting I'm glad I found you Instead of getting lost in Other people's Opinions. And yes And yes ratios make no sense make no sense in Roasting or brewing...

😻 'PromoSM'

Great to see the academy! Do you have any more info on the Probatino modifications i.e. components used for the gas flow and monitoring?

The RoR-Discussion is based on the meaning of Scott RAO that the best tasting coffees he experienced in his life were roasts with a steady declining RoR curve

If you haven't yet, do try roasting on a conveyor pizza oven ( hot air impingement) and in a Rational combination oven. I've done both, as well as in my cast iron drum. Won't mention results... There are some interesting observations on time to FC and roast color results awaiting you. Try it yourself if you care to

I can only say that the best sentence from the whole video is: "actually we have measured it". There is so much low quality "pseudo science" on YT on coffee (not only on coffee of course) that sometimes you just want to switch it all off. Always a pleasure to listen to Morten :)

I love this seminar because it calms my obsessive side. This is good news! Great coffee is still a lot of work, but we can put in that work where it makes a bigger difference.

Thanks for a great webinar! Question: When you aim for agtron 75 at 3 minutes, are you meassuring whole beans or ground beans?

Wanted to watch originally, now I am happy I can see it now

Fabulous content!

Great that the RoR considerations are continuing to be understood. The initial RoR development was on an experimental hybrid design roaster that specifically had almost no metal mass. Mechanical agitation and low air flow, electric heat.

got the bundle, thank you for the knowledge and sharing, all the best, Denis

Until you can find a better way to systematically judge smell and color of coffee development than time IE to fast or slow development then time in roast cycle color and smell will always be the judge of optimal development. I am okay with you not liking time and rate of rise and the judge of development, however you have not suggested an alternative method of tracking the development life cycle in roasting coffee either. I would also argue slowing down the rate of rise right before the first crack starts a gentle soft first crack as energy exports from the bean in every crack. This slows down the malliard reaction the sugar chain development and stretching it out as long as possible to the beginning of second crack. I opt to reduce the gas right before first crack until it is finished then gently raise the gas gently every minute softly to the beginning of audible second crack and finish of the roast. This is optimal all though you could argue this is objective taste preference, and I would say you are right. Basically reducing the gas right before the first crack exothermic state keeps the energy on the same path in general. Not reducing it before exothermic adds energy to the equation instead of keeping it consistant. Not adding heat back in after first crack will stall energy and the roast moving forward into the second exothermic state second crack and end of roast for me. Stalled state or raise of rise causes fermented yeast type bread flavors. Push a roast to fast through the development phases causes black tipping or scorching on the tops and bottoms of the beans. Also to agrissive development causing fisures blow holes in the beans structure in an aggressive cracking phase. TAKEAWAY = if you don't want to use time and temperature IE rate of rise, you must suggest an alternative to measuring the development stages in roasting consistantantly. You have not done that.

Well said. The only reason we even consider it, is because someone wrote a book about how important it is. The shape of the bean curve and thus the ROR is so dependent on machine design (thermal insulation, bean probe location/thickness, etc). If I base everything on a "pretty" shaped ROR curve on my 6kg machine, this would have me hitting FC around 8min and dropping coffees too early. Or, because my machine is so well insulated, I would need to have a lower turning point to have a steeper curve during the drying phase and it would require lowering my preheat quite a bit and then firing harder then I would normally. In reality, if I hit FC at 8 min, the coffee will taste good for 2-5 days and then flavor drops off fast, whereas a FC around 9:15-9:45 seems to be the sweet spot for my machine and results in a full-flavored cup that holds on to flavor for over a month.

Another great presentation! Always learn so much.

Simply thanks you!!!

Morten, I love the content and your approach. I can only compare it to the audio Hi-Fi and Hi-End industry, where everybody is sure to hear the difference between two $1000 cables...but nobody does blind tests. My only complain is that the prices on your website are not very attractive. Unfortunately the sensory training kit is soooo expensive :(... I bough it but still feel very uncomfortable with the price I paid. Plus there are some bundles that when you buy like two of them (different ones) you get severa items twice (or you do not get any discount if you receive it once) - like the taste wheel for example. I think that your educational offer still needs to be improved, but the approach and insight is great.

As always inspiring in its simplicity. Teaching and creation of vision at one time 😊🤝👌 Thank you Morten and Ida!

phenomenal interview thanks! makes me all the more excited to get mine next week!

This is such a great conversation, thank you Morten and Tim!

Love my Bullet! Combines my two passions: coffee and technology.

nice!

Thanks for the great presentation, Morten. Well explained. It gives me a new perspective on research and problem solving.

Thank you for the great and valuable content ❤️