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I just picked up the two “Parable…” books from the “Earthseed” duology for my Library, so I went for the ‘most people’ option too! Can’t recall if I mentioned already but where I have the first Bakker trilogy on my shelves, a friend at work has actually started reading them. It’s unusual that we overlap books, partly because he’s super picky. I may have already mentioned that I fancied prioritising “The Darkness That Comes Before” so we could compare notes.

Thanks for the discussion! I’m glad you attempted to have a lot of nuance in the discussion instead of hitting the topic without considering multiple angles. In 2024 my theories on this topic all come down to market realities and where the money is at and I’m glad you presented those options as potential realities as well

I did a buddy read with Whitney and Bart, and through general chit chat they have definitely convinced me to raise Dawn up the tbr. I’m hoping to get to it next year. Especially as I really liked Earthseed which I read last month. I also need to read more Le Guin. I just reread The Left Hand of Darkness with my bookclub and really loved it. Sounds like you had a great month :)

I remember reading The Word for World is Forest over three decades ago. Loved it, so I need to read it again. Thanks for the video 🙏

I remember Brittany really loving The Word for World is Forest, but it had totally fallen off my radar again. Glad you enjoyed it, those themes sound super interesting! Also heeeeck yes for Murata. I loved Earthlings and really need to get to CSW. Great reviews as always 🥰

I read Word for World is Forest a couple of years ago and loved it. The villain, the army guy POV, is so loathsome!

Dawn (and the Xenogenesis trilogy as a whole) was my introduction to Octavia E. Butler's works, and her series are similar in that they stand alone as each their own stories in the series with a overarching timeline and world. I call them generational stories even though they are not always, well, following the same lineage. I need to read Fledgling and the Patternmaster series, then I'll have read all of Butler's works. I can't wait for her biography to be published next year! I still think about Convenience Store Woman even though I read it in January of this year. There was a such a catharsis in reading it. So I'm glad you enjoyed it!

Uh oh... Philip is now going to do the Booktube Betrayal Tag! 😂 You need to do the Meditations video with Allen haha. It sounds like November was great - I hope December is great for you too!

I am happy that you finished the Second Apocalypse and that you liked it. It is such a controversial but masterfully written series. So many great concepts. It is very difficult to realise them all while reading. The Bakker forums and subredfit were a revelation for me. The subtlety, the connections, the theories and meta implications are numerous and fascinating. Mind blowing. I actually could not appreciate anything in the genre for months after finishing the series. And years now it is still my absolute measure. I still find it very difficult to appreciate fiction because Bakker set my standards. Not even Malazan which I have dnf three times at various volumes through the ages or other famous series. My first cure 5-6 months after finishing the Unholy Consult was rereading the series. That was a phenomenal ride. Knowing what happens and how it connects made the rereading a truly revelatory experience. Like the deciphering of a scriptural codex. Sentences from the very first paragraphs took a whole new meaning. It is insane how well thought and crafted is this series. I cannot wait for your discussions

Great video as always 😊 I loved Dawn too and have Word for World is Forest on my shelf. Intrigued by Convenience Shop Girl…

I really can't wait for your TGO discussion with Dr. Chase. Many didn't see TUC's events coming, but the "what?!" moment had metaphysical factors that could be traced all the way back to Book 1. When I re-read the series for the first time my mind was blown. Bakker truly is a genius.

I gotta read Convenience Store Woman! Been wanting to dig into Japanese literature for a while now. As for R.L. Stine…his published decided to make “changes in his books in 2017 to “modernize” them….without his permission. They didn’t even let him know about it, he only recently discovered what they did. Just so you know.

Parable of the Sower really is engrossing. Butler has a way of affecting the reader and making the story feel real. She pairs nicely with Le Guin too. As always, I love your variety 🙌

I really need to read some Butler and Le Guin. Two huge holes in my reading. Awesome month!

What a cool month! You have me particularly intrigued by Convenience Store Woman, which sounds both fun and deep.

Hi Johanna. Thank YOU for the shout out! You’re a comparison of Ice and The Word for World is very interesting! I had not thought of it; but yes, there is quite an overlap when it comes to the themes explored. One thing to add regarding Leguin‘s book; it was inspired in part by her negative reaction to the Vietnam war. And yes, like you and Whitney, I really enjoyed Dawn. Speaking of Whitney. Thank you for pairing us together in the Why Read episode. We’ve become good friends, did a great buddy read and video together lol. Thanks. ❤️

I also listened to NLR's interview with Janny Wurts, and it was incredibly inspiring. Convenience Store Woman sounds really good and something I need to get to next year. I know you loved Perdido Street Station from Discord, but I'm still very excited to hear you talk about it in a video! It's such a phenomenal book. I actually read it last December and haven't been able to stop thinking about it since.

Haven't read this Le Guin's yet, thanks for the review. Looking forward to your commentary on Meditations. Great video

You gonna read “The Book of the New Sun”? 🤔 by Gene

I think The Word for World is Forest is much more of a direct criticism of the Vietnam war specifically. There's a native people who live in a jungle environment who are bombarded with 'fire jelly' - a clear stand-in for napalm. Need to read Dawn because it sounds great!

Great reviews ! I really want to start my Le Guin journey next year. Idk where to start. I might pick up The Word For World is Forest. I Now. I did read Parable of the Sower but sadly did not continue. Ill also need to pick up book two before moving on to her other works. Hearing you describe Convenience Store Woman made me realize I need to re-read it !!! its so good.

Awesome video! Cant wait to get to Bakker someday soon, every video you or Philip chat about it has me wanting to say TBR be damned 😂 Loved Dawn as well! RL Stine was the first author I fell in love with as a kid. So cool!

Hearing you talk about Bakker's work gets me so intrigued to read it! It seems like such a unique and special reading experience. Thanks for sharing my video with Janny 😊 she is so full of wisdom!!

The hold the comment secxtion has on Allen is very sad. Who cares what the peanut gallery think? Allen rules and shouldn't read what us boneheads type

If someone called my personal diaries 'pretty good' a thousand or so years later, I would be satisfied haha...its unfortunate how Meditations gets discussed now with certain groups of people who may interpret it in the wrong way, but I agree, Meditations has some great nuggets of wisdom throughout.

I’m not quite finished with The Great Ordeal, but at the moment I can’t imagine wanting to jump straight into The Unholy Consult without taking a break to scrub my brain of some of the bleakness after wallowing in it throughout the book. 😂 But perhaps Bakker will surprise me, or I’ll surprise myself. Either way, I’m excited to chat with you soon, Johanna!

The second apocalypse was a big disappointment for me.

Excited to read the “Aspect Emperor” series next year! “Meditations” is a nice introduction to Stoicism, I am myself planning to read a collection of Seneca (Stoic and tutor of Nero) early next year, maybe even January! Cheers and skål! 😄

Hello there hey there hey Hello hi hello hi there

Cannot wait to hear your thoughts on Perdido Street Station!

I could not help but to make comparison with the contemporary “Dune”: While are very different in tone/atmosphere/style (even in their shared theme of Buddhism, Herbert was clearly having a more serious and genuine interest into the practical side of (Zen) Buddhism, and even that is just one part of the many other schools of thoughts that influenced him), it is clear both Zelazny and Herbert shared a healthy skepticism against the powerful and used their books to point out both the technical and social mechanisms that the powerful could use to stay in power. Both have “reluctant saviors” with superhuman enhancements at the core of their stories, using the indigenous population and the dispossessed as their primary base of support for their rebellion in true “Lawrence of Arabia” style. “Yama”, the “Death God” as the weapons guy: Probably a riff on Robert Oppenheimer, with he famously quoting Krishna from the “Bhagavad Gita” during the Trinity Nuclear Bomb Test: “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds”. “Mara”, the illusionist pretending to be “Kali”, also becomes SO much more emotional, when you clearly see “Yama” is in love with Kali and almost married her! “Krishna” claiming Sam/“Buddha” as one of his avatars: Fun jab of how a rebel against the Hindu Caste System, have been cast as part of it… Also a fun callback during the hunting scene with Rudra and Murugan, when they say that Sam went by “Kalkin” in the days he sent the “Demons” underground, as a reference to Vishnu’s future tenth and final avatar, “Kalki” who is said will bring our timeline to an apocalyptic end and start a new and rejuvenated one. Also the whole hunting scene is great fun: “You Fertility Deities are worse than Marxists!” 😆 And the whole Rudra being rebuffed by Kali as she is “too cold”, for only then tell that when Kali’s preferred boytoy poet lover got reincarnated as a bird, Rudra ruthlessly hunted and killed out the whole species: Ouch! 😅 “Then the fit hit the Shan”! 😆

Great video. I'm reading "The warrior prophet" and I'm impressed by Bakker writing. I loved "The Word for world is Forest" and "Dawn", and also, all the Xenogenesis Trilogy. I'll look for "Convenience Store Woman". Thank you.

Completely agree on needing to jump right into UC. Once Bakker is in your head, hard to get him out and think about something else. It is the only book I just had to step away from after the scene you referenced. Will see how Philip's more delicate constitution holds up. Listened to Varsha's discussion and I missed a lot as I was focused on the action. But it is interesting that it is the female characters take center stage. And it does have the best final line of any book I have read. But didn't immediately know it as I didn't realize there were 200 pages of appendicies.

I just started my malazan journey, I read book one recently and it was so cool! Really different from all the books I’ve been reading recently ahah it took me abit to get acclimated but once I was nearing the end I couldn’t put it down!

Great video Johanna! I agree that Meditations is one of those books that deserves to be slowly digested. I’m excited to eventually try the Hanish cycle.

🔥 🔥 ❤ - loved hearing your thoughts on these books esp on word for world :) 🌎 Aww i’m so glad I convinced you to pickup Dawn! My purpose is now complete….. 😊no rush on these rest of series. I would rather u pickup parable of sower :)

Interesting to hear your thoughts about Unholy Consult, and I am glad that you really loved it. Unfortunately, I cannot share your love, as to me it was a two star read, and clearly the worst of all the seven books of the series. Already Great Ordeal was a step down from the earlier excellence of especially White-Luck Warrior, but this was such a fall from grace. All, of course, only in my totally honest opinion. The Word for World Is Forest is a really good book, but in my ranking, it is still clearly behind Dispossessed, Lathe of Heaven and Left Hand of Darkness. God, LeGuin is such a good sci-fi author!

On LeGuin, have you read The Lathe of Heaven yet? Her best standalone by far. On Butler, I'm looking forward to your thoughts on Adulthood Rights. My favorite book of hers by far. Simply the best exploration of mixed identinty in science fiction of that era.

I really need to get to Butler soon. Had her scifi vampire novel Fledgling on my shelf too long. 😳Just never found the right moment to pick it up.

Johanna, I can't lie to you, I read Malazan all the way to halfway through The Crippled God, and I stopped. I read Second Apocalypse all the way to end of The Great Ordeal, and I stopped. Now I'm forced to reread both so I can finish them fully! I have no idea why I let myself do it. Life must have come knocking. Maybe there was some Malazan fatigue. Either way, I start Dust of Dreams in the new year. 🙂

The Word for World is Forest ❤ Second Apocalypse is a wild, disturbing thought provoking experience. While I've always been a skeptic of religion and spirituality (and cynical of the organisations and institutions), books like these that examine it on a personal and worldwide level is some of my favourite content to read about. Only books i read in November were Tad Williams' To Green Angel Tower and Janny Wurts' Warhost of Vastmark which was my book of the month. NGL, I can see you being very underwhelmed by Memory Sorrow & Thorn.

When I finished The Unholy Consult, I slammed the book down and jumped out of my chair and paced back and forth nonstop for about 20mins in shocked that Bakker had the cojones to end the series in that fashion. But the highlight of the book for me was the Proyas Achamian reunion. It was so emotional. The Great Ordeal and The Unholy Consult are a split book so it only makes sense to jump on The Unholy Consult after finishing The Great Ordeal since in reality it's The Great Ordeal's third act. I've struggled for years now to read epic fantasy after finishing The Second Apocalypse. It is the apotheosis of epic fantasy for me, because nothing I've read since has been remotely as impactful. I'm just hoping George finally finishes The Winds of Winter because ASOIAF is the only thing out in contemporary fantasy that I rate as highly. I picked up Dawn over a year ago but haven't found the time to read it but it and the rest of the Lillith's Brood books are a priority on my tbr for 2025. I hope to add some Leguin too. Looking forward to your discussions with Philip on the final two books of TSA. I hope it doesn't get too dark for him. Thanks for sharing your thoughts

do you plan to read elric by michael moorcock?

❤📚📚❤️ My sister and I are buddy reading Kindred in February. 😊 I added Convenience Store Woman to my list. Thank you.

Sounds like a great month of reading! If you want to continue enraging Allen then the next reads should be Ulysses by Joyce and anything by Dickens. Haha 😂 Also that scene from the RL Stine book is eerily similar to a scene from The Counselor by Cormac McCarthy.

When I finished the last book in the Second Apocalypse, I was... I was actually very confused haha. I'll be looking forward to your discussion.

Can't wait to hear more of your thoughts on Bakker's Second Apocalypse in its entirety, though one thing I came to realize is that while The Unholy Consult completes The aspect emperor cycle The Second Apocalypse as a whole is not yet finished. I do truly hope Bakker finds the time, inspiration and resources to deliver us the rest of what is my second favorite series of all time.

THAT scene in Toll the Hounds is awful and I regret reading anywhere near it

Merphy encouraging Allen to read Lies gives me life.

shout out to Allen for not forgetting me