Christian Rock and Metal Collective
Christian Rock and Metal Collective
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Should We Support AI Christian Rock/Metal?
In this video I share my thoughts on why we should NOT support Christian rock/metal music created using artificial intelligence.
มุมมอง: 376

วีดีโอ

Michael Bloodgood on Les Carlsen’s Age and Funny Concert Moment
มุมมอง 78หลายเดือนก่อน
Michael Bloodgood on Les Carlsen’s Age and Funny Concert Moment
You Must Listen to This Band - Behold the Beloved
มุมมอง 262หลายเดือนก่อน
I absolutely love Behold the Beloved’s sound, but even more than that I love their message. These guys are the real deal all three phases of Christian music, sound, message, and authenticity. I highly recommend you check them out! Here’s their website below. beholdthebelovedmusic.com
Stryper - When We Were Kings - Unboxing/Review
มุมมอง 518หลายเดือนก่อน
Stryper has been going strong for 40 years. Pretty amazing when you consider they are still cranking out two albums a year and producing some amazing music. Thanks to Steve from @stevescoolstuff126 ​for providing this copy for review! Check out his channel and amazing content below. youtube.com/@stevescoolstuff126?si=e_j9ypJGVwoxo9pU Afilliate links: CD: amzn.to/4exPYzE Vinyl: (color not disclo...
Mind Blowing Theocracy Collection?
มุมมอง 129หลายเดือนก่อน
I have built quite the Theocracy collection over the years. In fact, there are a few items that are quite hard to find. Check it out!
Degarmo and Key - Girder CD Collection
มุมมอง 95หลายเดือนก่อน
Girder Records is doing some amazing things with classic Christian Rock. Degarmo and Key give me “Eddie Money” vibes. It’s so nice to see some of these classics given fresh life! girdermusic.com/collections/degarmo-and-key
Resurrection Band Remastered CDs - Compared to Originals
มุมมอง 90หลายเดือนก่อน
⁠ Music has done it AGAIN! These two albums were sold as a combo in 1991 and it is nearly impossible to find. The Grr Records re-issue is even harder to find. If you find them they are going to be EXPENSIVE. Now, not only can you get them, but you can get them for under $20 each. In this video I compare them to the original vinyl and cassettes, and I also compare them to the 1991 remasters done...
Amazing Classic Metal Available Again!
มุมมอง 96หลายเดือนก่อน
I’ve been a customer of Girder Music every since they landed those huge pallets of unopened Benson vinyl from the 80s and 90s (about 5 years). Since that point they have become pioneers in the resurgence of amazing Christian bands from that same era. Records and CDs that were long out of print and fetching some big bucks on eBay and Discogs are now not only affordable, but done on a level we ha...
Christian Rock and Metal Man-cave!
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I have a decent little collection of many things. My basement is the one area my wife gave me total decorative freedom and I didn’t hold back!
Top Five Female Christian Rock/Metal Vocalists
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Here’s a video featuring my top five female vocalists in Christian Rock/Metal.
Top 7 Christian Rock Bands
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You saw my top five Christian metal bands. Now let’s take a look at my top five Christian Rock bands.
Harpazo - A Christian Metal Opera - Concept Album
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Harpazo’s The Crucible isn’t just a Christian Metal album, it’s a complete experience. A concept album with a Rock Opera flare, it tells the story of Michael and Jude Solomon. It is set in 2142, and Jude is the CEO of Ichor, an advanced prosthetics corporation, who plans to use a serum that will create super humans that will merge with machinery and become immortal. His goal is to rule the worl...
Massive Chaotic Resemblance Giveaway
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Massive Chaotic Resemblance Giveaway
Interview with Chaotic Resemblance Part 2
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Interview with Chaotic Resemblance Part 2
Chaotic Resemblance Interview Part 1 - From Future Rock Star to Jesus Lover
มุมมอง 5174 หลายเดือนก่อน
Chaotic Resemblance Interview Part 1 - From Future Rock Star to Jesus Lover
Chaotic Resemblance - New Song - Move
มุมมอง 1.4K4 หลายเดือนก่อน
Chaotic Resemblance - New Song - Move
Top Five Petra Albums
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Top Five Petra Albums
Millennial Reign - World On Fire - Pre-release
มุมมอง 1374 หลายเดือนก่อน
Millennial Reign - World On Fire - Pre-release
Unpackaging of a Chaotic Resemblance Merch Bag!
มุมมอง 1334 หลายเดือนก่อน
Unpackaging of a Chaotic Resemblance Merch Bag!
Ulterium Records - Pre-release! Theocracy & Millennial Reign
มุมมอง 2074 หลายเดือนก่อน
Ulterium Records - Pre-release! Theocracy & Millennial Reign
My Top Five Christian Metal Albums
มุมมอง 1.3K4 หลายเดือนก่อน
My Top Five Christian Metal Albums
My Top Five Christian Vinyl Cover Artwork
มุมมอง 1655 หลายเดือนก่อน
My Top Five Christian Vinyl Cover Artwork
My Top Five Christian Metal Bands
มุมมอง 21K5 หลายเดือนก่อน
My Top Five Christian Metal Bands
Check Out My Stryper Collection! Plus my Top 5 Stryper Albums.
มุมมอง 1K5 หลายเดือนก่อน
Check Out My Stryper Collection! Plus my Top 5 Stryper Albums.
Ulterium Records - Sneak Peek - Treasure Seeker - A Tribute to the Past
มุมมอง 2386 หลายเดือนก่อน
Ulterium Records - Sneak Peek - Treasure Seeker - A Tribute to the Past
Girder Records - Petra Captured in Time and Space Compared to Originals
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Girder Records - Petra Captured in Time and Space Compared to Originals
Girder Records - Resurrection Band - Remastered CDs
มุมมอง 577 หลายเดือนก่อน
Girder Records - Resurrection Band - Remastered CDs
Ulterium Records Blew My Mind!
มุมมอง 757 หลายเดือนก่อน
Ulterium Records Blew My Mind!
Rez Band Girder vs Grrr! - How Do They Compare + Vinyl and Cassettes
มุมมอง 527 หลายเดือนก่อน
Rez Band Girder vs Grrr! - How Do They Compare Vinyl and Cassettes
Girder Color Splash Vinyl - The Brave & Mastedon
มุมมอง 357 หลายเดือนก่อน
Girder Color Splash Vinyl - The Brave & Mastedon

ความคิดเห็น

  • @WillSmithsMom
    @WillSmithsMom 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Question for you. If you were to sit and have a conversation with Jesus himself what would he say? Would he say YES use any resource available to spread the gospel because peoples eternal destinations depend on it. Or would he say NO you cant use AI music to spread the gospel?? Peoples souls are WAY WAY more important than our likes or dislikes. Why do we as Christians always tear each other down and attack each other because we don't personally like what someone else is doing? If someone is using AI music to reach people for the gospel and share Jesus with others why would you be against it? Is their soul not more important to you than your dislike of AI? I think you should pray this over. We as Christians have got to stop this division and unite together for the benefit of lost souls. If someone's AI music turns 1 person to Jesus and they surrender their life to Him is it not worth it? If something points people to Jesus we should support it regardless if we like it or not. The bible is VERY clear on that.

  • @jlcc8060
    @jlcc8060 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

    All the vocals sound the same! I can't listen to a whole song made by AI because they never hit me like REAL metal does. I appreciate you making this video because I am fully on your side. GOOD muscians put lots of time into making music, and there's something about that which makes it sound so much better then something that just appears out of no where. I never heard a catchy, hooky, or some what good AI generated song! I pray they don't start playing these songs on radio!

  • @johnpatitucci7919
    @johnpatitucci7919 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I do it for fun. It's pretty funny what it'll write sometimes.

  • @marieward3212
    @marieward3212 8 วันที่ผ่านมา

    So glad you shed light on this . I agree with you . God Bless you for sharing

  • @BlindMelvin
    @BlindMelvin 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I am a musician and I have a Christian AI music channel also and the reason I use AI to make music is to make the kind of music that I like to listen to with a Christ centered theme. When I happen to listen to the music on the radio nowadays, it all sounds like the same garbage to me. With AI I can envision new sounds with it and make it all in a day and have it on the air and ready to share. Welcome to the new McDonald’s of music. I hope you like my tasty ‘rock of the nation’ McRib music.

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Personally, I won’t support it, but I am not adamantly against those that do.

    • @BlindMelvin
      @BlindMelvin 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@christianrockmusiccollective as a musician, in the beginning I was originally against this. I finally came to realize, to me it didn’t matter how it was made if it rocked me or got me closer to the Lord. ❤️‍🩹

  • @stevescoolstuff126
    @stevescoolstuff126 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    th-cam.com/video/ZXD4JRh5VSs/w-d-xo.htmlsi=pyDdzAQdIZIuWp4a

  • @soldier7778
    @soldier7778 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I mostly agree with you on AI. It can sound sterile, dry, lifeless and formula based with little variety in musical style. These AI channels started appearing on my youtube feeds the past month or so. I prefer actual artists putting their effort into their craft or their spin on previously written songs as covers. I do think there is a need to revive many of these timeless old hymns like How Great Thou Art, Nothing but the Blood, etc in a melodic format ranging from Rock to Metal but keeping the original feel of the song intact. On another note the gospel is getting out there. I'm not sure if there is a scripture anywhere going against AI other than something like this that might be used in the "image of the beast" in Revelation in a deceptive way like a hologram. In 1 Corinthians 9:22 it says: "to the weak I became as weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some." It is not clear if the creators intent is to make $$$ on this technology or to get a message out there. Many writers of modern CCM aren't even Christian but are hired to write formulaic poppy songs mostly praise oriented. This AI avenue may be another way of doing this. In both cases of the CCM industry and AI, the Biblical accuracy of songs in some cases are questionable. Also, many of the images on these AI videos like the medieval Maltese cross is masonic in origin and not Biblical or at least questionable. Basically, I'm skeptical of this AI technology in writing songs. I don't mind AI being used in creating a lyric video if the actual song is written, recorded and produced by actual people.

    • @RayRice-lr8vi
      @RayRice-lr8vi 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

      See Wolves at the Gate "Come Thou Long Expected Jesus" as an example of excellent old hymn covers

  • @americanpatriot581
    @americanpatriot581 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I love this because human Christian groups for some reason don’t want to sing the old hymns. Until they do I will support these groups

  • @Michael1969_
    @Michael1969_ 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I AGREE WITH YOU BROTHER

  • @PsalmOfTheRedeemer
    @PsalmOfTheRedeemer 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I respect your opinions and agree with you on some topics, however I mostly disagree. I would encourage you to reach out to these bands and learn their heart. I personally am not trying to detract from any real artists but there are very few bands out there making metal music of my taste that I can worship to. So I started making my own with AI. There's a lot more that goes into AI music than you think. If you look at my channel you will see the outcome of THOUSANDS of hours of work. My only goal with my music is for people to worship the King of Kings listening to it. Many of us have had dreams of being a part of a band or making music for years but just don't have the time or resources to make that happen, but with AI we do. The whole point of music is 100% to worship God. If the lyrics do that and people worship singing along to it there really shouldn't be an issue. Yes I agree that a human band has much more to it and we should support those bands. But these AI bands are using the resources available to them to point people to Jesus. Anything that draws people to Jesus and to a heart of worship is a good thing in my book, AI or not. Everything we do is for the glory of God. The bible is clear that our God is God over ALL things, including AI, which was created by men who were created in the image of God. I see it as another tool for people like me to reach people for Jesus and create music that praises the name of Jesus. I pray over every single song I make and ask God to direct it and make it glorify him. That people will worship Him when they listen to it. I respect your opinion to not listen to or support AI bands, but don't bash us for doing what we can to make Jesus known.

  • @johnbmx4christ
    @johnbmx4christ 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I already subscribe to all the channels you showed. I'm fine with it. It's getting the gospel out. There's so much good stuff out there right now. I'm even gonna do a drum cover of one. The sowers that you showed also have quite a few excellent songs. There just needs to be more newer Christian metal bands and these are filling that gap right now.

  • @jd_unrah
    @jd_unrah 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I super agree, we need more christisn metal bands to cover the old hymns.

  • @henryvanderzwan9134
    @henryvanderzwan9134 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I also noticed this in the last month. The growth of these channels is astounding. I even think one person has maybe two or more channels? I reacted to Onward Christian Soldiers by Sanctuarium Metalli and said: Philippians 1 : 18. I don't really like the overproduced and compressed sound (especially the drums). But I guess AI pictures of Knights and crusaders for Christ can make a powerful impact. And overall the music is really 'epic'. But as I mentioned I am thinking Philippians 1 : 18 Where Paul says (17 But (...maybe....) the others preach about Christ for selfish and wrong reasons, wanting to make trouble for me in prison.) 18 But it doesn’t matter. The important thing is that in every way, whether for right or wrong reasons, they are preaching about Christ. So I am happy, and I will continue to be happy. As a songwriter myself I have spent countless hours this year of writing, recording, mixing but I congratulate these channels for their cleverness in marketing themselves and the message. During my recordings I always make mistakes. The big ones I get rid off. And sometimes the smaller ones I leave in the recording. Because then you know it is me haha. I am also curious about what other people think about this AI Christian music. But we can't get rid off it now anymore. There will probably come a time when it is almost impossible to detect if it is AI or not. But, looking back on the history of music. I think original music will somehow still survive. I like Oldschool metal and 70s and 80s rock, but after that it has generated so many new types and directions of metal and rock. I can't even keep up. So people will take music a step further, whereas AI it probably will digest what is already there. Anyways. Interesting topic for sure.

  • @MetalLizard7
    @MetalLizard7 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thanks for sharing.. I agree with you Bro 👍🎸✝️

  • @benhynum9879
    @benhynum9879 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    AI is a very polarizing subject. I am not necessarily against but when it comes to AI music I am a no.

  • @rbs550ford5
    @rbs550ford5 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thanks Tim!!!! This is what I have been missing since switching to Christian radio. I was watching the Dove Awards with my wife and I was surprised by some of the music and bands I saw... I asked my wife why I hadn't heard of some of these on the radio? So I did a Google search for Christian Rock bands and saw your review and that led me to your Christian Metal review!! Thanks for sharing Tim!!!

  • @amysson5151
    @amysson5151 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Been waiting for a Christian concept album. Can’t wait to hear this. Where can I buy? God bless and Metal on!

  • @davidhorn5771
    @davidhorn5771 19 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Does Neil Morse Band not meet your criteria for some reason?

  • @spock_elvis
    @spock_elvis 21 วันที่ผ่านมา

    But what isn't a Christian Metal Opera - Concept Album?

  • @AngelAngel-qm2ko
    @AngelAngel-qm2ko 21 วันที่ผ่านมา

    How can you not like final battle? 🙂 I do however agree with middle finger messiah. It's the only reason I have not purchased the album. I know it's only a play on words but because the times we live in I just think we need to be very clear on what we are saying. They could have used a better name. I personally like their newer stuff which really got me into Stryper. For the older stuff I like the album "Second Coming" I like the old songs updated.

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective 19 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Second Coming is awesome. It’s not that I don’t “like” Final Battle, it just seems redundant. However, redundant Stryper is still really good. I bought Even the Devil Believes on CD just to have it even though that song is on it, but I refuse to own GDE.

  • @TomPlantagenet
    @TomPlantagenet 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

    You gotta do one for Theocracy now!

  • @davidgould970
    @davidgould970 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    You really should check out Barnabus if you have not heard them. No way Nancy Jo Mann would not be on your list! The band was heavy and progressive. Brian Below was a great guitarist too.

  • @davidgould970
    @davidgould970 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Have you ever listened to Barnabus? SO good. And true pioneers of heavy Christian music.

  • @AngelAngel-qm2ko
    @AngelAngel-qm2ko 27 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Folks is it just me or is customer service really bad at Girder records? I'm still waiting on a new Stryper album and no one is getting back to me. That's the only downfall with Girder records and the way they treat customers. I just expect better for a so called Christian company...

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective 27 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I’ve never had any trouble with their customer service. Are you using email?

    • @AngelAngel-qm2ko
      @AngelAngel-qm2ko 27 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@christianrockmusiccollective OK that's what I did but also just sent a message through online form and seems to have worked this time after 2 emails. I think they need help over there on the customer service side of things. I appreciate your feedback thanks!

  • @theguythatdoesthatonething2133
    @theguythatdoesthatonething2133 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Bride Snakes in the playground might be the greatest vocal record of all time!!

  • @pumpkin1982
    @pumpkin1982 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Just found your channel, looking forward to more videos.

  • @nolifetilmetal1
    @nolifetilmetal1 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Thank you for the kind words. 😊

  • @adamsmith3238
    @adamsmith3238 หลายเดือนก่อน

    NO STRYPER!!! LOL!!! What an absolute joke.

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective หลายเดือนก่อน

      The joke is on you. They are in my top metal bands video. Stryper considers themselves metal and who am I to argue with them.

  • @stamosgre3356
    @stamosgre3356 หลายเดือนก่อน

    R.I.P

  • @underdog24861
    @underdog24861 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Awesome True Christian Band! I have my doubts about many Christian bands actually being Christians, but Bloodgood is not one of them. R.I.P. Michael Bloodgood.

  • @mattyskilling4522
    @mattyskilling4522 หลายเดือนก่อน

    They are a great band. Thanks for the review and the look at the CD's.

  • @thomashill8161
    @thomashill8161 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Gonna check 'em out. Thanks, for this. YIC ☮️✝️

  • @jlcc8060
    @jlcc8060 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I got see these guys live! I actually got a vip pass and got to meet them! There awsome! I also have all those CDs except for the EP! The different covers on the No Surrender sheet are only the covers that are on the singles which are only on streaming services. And No Surrender Hope will rise has acoustic versions of some of the No Surrender album.

  • @TomPlantagenet
    @TomPlantagenet หลายเดือนก่อน

    So glad I found your Christian metal channel. I’ve watched some of your Bible videos over the years. Theocracy is the best band in my honest opinion. I remember when it was only Matt with the first album! Now they have an amazing catalog.!

  • @TomPlantagenet
    @TomPlantagenet หลายเดือนก่อน

    Sounds similar to Terium from the description

  • @AngelAngel-qm2ko
    @AngelAngel-qm2ko หลายเดือนก่อน

    It's good but not as good as the final battle.

  • @MetalLizard7
    @MetalLizard7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Great review. Awesome album. I got mine recently too,. My yellow /black vinyl is not half/ half . It is in quarters - yellow /black 😎

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective หลายเดือนก่อน

      Whoa! That’s cool.

    • @ced777
      @ced777 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Seems the orders from frontier EUrop are quarters splitted LP, and US are half :D (got mine quarter as well as another friend, ordered to Frontiersshop EUr) ALl my friend from US got and half split

  • @RPModelRailroads
    @RPModelRailroads หลายเดือนก่อน

    What an awesome Petra collection! Wow!

  • @mocoleman5579
    @mocoleman5579 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Best metal band on the planet! That's all bands, not just Christian. No other band has the same quality in their song writing, singing, guitars, drums & mixing all together. They literally have not made a bad song. All of their albums are extremely good & they are almost all equal. Nice collection! Thanks for showing.

  • @soldier7778
    @soldier7778 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Great video! I canceled the Frontiers order and got my refund so I can buy the CD at a local store last Monday September 16. I will reorder some items on Frontiers without the CD. I listened to it this week several times and I like the album. The more I listen to it the more I like it. Not keen on Raptured though for some reason. Wasn't keen on Betrayed by Love but It's growing on me. It's not unusual for me to not like a song or 2 on an album. At this point, I would rank the new album around the middle of the last 6 albums. I think my ranking would be: 1. Even the Devil Believes 2. Fallen 3. No More Hell to Pay 4. When We Were Kings 5. God, Damn Evil 6. The Final Battle. I think I will eventually go through the 5 albums to see if this current ranking will change. Stryper and those who work behind the scenes work very hard and it shows. Michael Sweet mentioned doing 21 Stryper studio albums which is 5 more if you count The Covering, Second Coming and To Hell with the Amps which is currently a total of 16 albums so far. If he achieves this it will be pretty impressive. I have a question: On the album cover, Christ is wearing a crown of thorns as he seems to be in His Glory or post resurrection. Is that Biblical? Also, is it wrong to produce an image of Christ on artwork? I don't think it is as long as it's not the object of worship but an appreciation of the artist in making Christ relatable.

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective หลายเดือนก่อน

      I do not believe it is an issue to have artwork of Christ.

    • @InlinePaul
      @InlinePaul หลายเดือนก่อน

      Couple of my favorites on this album are Raptured and Trinity. I have a hard time ranking the albums but Fallen is at the top of my list. Problem is a lot of them are at the top of my list. The only Stryper albums I am not as keen on are Reborn and Murder by Pride. Murder by Pride would have been better as a Michael Sweet solo album, not Stryper. Best bet is to put them all your favorite Stryper Albums (that is 12 for me, including 7 Weeks Live In America) on a MP3 player and run shuffle! Oh, I disagree with their eschatology (I am not a dispensationalist) so those songs can bug me if I listen to the lyrics to closely but those songs also tend to be some of the hardest rocking cuts too. Second coming is great but you just can't replicate the original youthful singing. Oh, forgot about To Hell with the Amps and cannot see myself buying that one unless in the dollar bin. Stryper is about metal and metal is about amps. Not sure what they were thinking to go without the amps. I really am not fond of any of the new covers. I prefer covers like they had in the 1980s. Although the original THWTD cover was similar to their more recent covers. Anyway, Stryper is my favorite metal band and about the onlhy metal I listen to other than Bloodgood, especially their 2013 album with Oz Fox.

  • @lukasjacobi627
    @lukasjacobi627 หลายเดือนก่อน

    How much are you getting paid for this promotion?

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective หลายเดือนก่อน

      Are you serious? I bought this stuff and my channel isn’t even monetized.

    • @lukasjacobi627
      @lukasjacobi627 หลายเดือนก่อน

      So you are doing this just for the love of music. That is good.​@@christianrockmusiccollective

  • @lukasjacobi627
    @lukasjacobi627 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Got the original Bloodgoods ...

  • @lukasjacobi627
    @lukasjacobi627 หลายเดือนก่อน

    missing ur further petra unboxings

  • @ChaoticResemblance
    @ChaoticResemblance หลายเดือนก่อน

    Love Theocracy!

  • @RB-in2zh
    @RB-in2zh หลายเดือนก่อน

    Beat the system was a great album

  • @tacomant6764
    @tacomant6764 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Discovered this band last fall - they are now my favorite band. Awesome collection brother!🔥👊🏻

  • @jamesmichaelis1483
    @jamesmichaelis1483 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Ridiculous

  • @generationomega9342
    @generationomega9342 หลายเดือนก่อน

    DAVID ZAFFIRO ✅ The Other Side ✅ In Scarlet Storm ✅ Surrender Absolute ✅ Yesterday's Left Behind 'Nuff said 😎👍

  • @Kenmo.6274
    @Kenmo.6274 หลายเดือนก่อน

    MOS is their best album hands down. Mosaic actually comes very very close to it. Laying The Demon To Rest is their best song across all albums. Great band.

    • @christianrockmusiccollective
      @christianrockmusiccollective หลายเดือนก่อน

      Laying the Demons to Rest is definitely among the top if not the top for me. So many layers!