I disagree with the Obstruction interpretation for the 2nd play with the catcher and the pay at the plate. This is not an obvious obstruction call. My judgement is that the ball was obtained just before the contact with a runner. The runner was never impeded (veer, stutter, change direction, slow down, contact made , etc.) until after the catcher caught the ball. Once the defender has possession of the ball, and no prior impedance occurred, there is no more obstruction to consider. Being that the runner continued the whole way without being impeded and the contact on that play happened after the catcher obtained the ball (or at least almost simultaneously and you have to slow down the video to see it), I would judge (seeing it at full speed) this as a legal play.
In this situation, because the pop up ball was near the foul line, the umpire would declare "infield fly if fair". If it's the ball is on the foul side of the line when caught, then there would not be an infield fly rule in affect and the batter would not be instantly out. The catch would need be made in foul territory for the batter to be out. The umpire has to wait to see where the the ball is in relation to the foul line to make a determination. Since this ball was in fair territory when touched or caught, then the infield fly rule would be in affect and the batter would be called out and be considered a retired runner. My question is: While the umpire waits to determine if the infield fly will be in affect (due to the ball being near the foul line), the batter is still not technically out until such determination is made. As she can still run and is a legal batter runner until the determination is made and if the determination is made to be an infield fly at the moment of contact between the batter runner and the fielder, then could that batter runner be considered as being a live legal runner at the moment of contact and only the batter runner would be called out and all other runners return to their former bases from the time of the pitch? Because the pop up ball is near the foul line, the batter runner could actually interfere with the fielder prior to the infield fly being determined. Does that timing of everything happening matter? Thanks.
Bases loaded. 1 Out. 3rd baseman touches 3rd. Runner on 3rd is safe as there was no tag and runner coming from 2nd is out because of a force play. 2 outs Throw home nets zero outs as it was no longer a force play. Throw back to 3rd with the tag on the runner coming from 2nd still nets no outs because that runner was already out from the touching of 3rd base force out The runner on 3rd assumes she was out so she makes herself out by walking to the dugout. Inning over The runner from 3rd tries to go and touch home plate after the fact, run shouldn't count because at this point way out of the base paths and gave herself up earlier by going to the dugout. Inning still over.
3 man rotation is tough. The 1B umpire should have went out to get catch/no catch. Home plate should have moved towards third, but been close enough to make the call at home. Runner might have been out at home.
From this camera view it looks like she was safe. From the base ump view she was out. Coach obviously thought she was safe too, thats why he was not a happy camper.
It's not you. In this situation the inside umpire has fly ball responsibilities from the left fielder to the right fielder. It is referred to as the "Cone". The 1B umpire has from the right fielder to the fence and the PU has from the left fielder to the fence. Properly executed, the 1B umpire goes out to rule on fair/foul, catch/no catch, and dead ball/live ball. Once he goes out, he stays out. Once he does that the other two umpires revert to two-man mechanics. The 3B umpire comes inside the diamond and has primary responsibility for first and second base. The PU has primary responsibility for 3B and home. The PU also stays outside the diamond. All three of them blew the coverage.
Agree with rejection that should have been assigned...and agree with the comment on...What was the umpire doing/looking at??? If it was the winning inning I would recommend she be rejected for the season or at least the next game.
IF that coach had taught her catcher to properly position herself at home plate on this type of play, she would have had a shot at cleanly catching the throw and making a tag... Absolutely NO offensive interference...
Bad optics is an understatement - calling foul then HR - but appealing (more like arguing) Coach should have been ejected after continuing to argue after all officials gathered and rendered a final decision. I'm not even sure it's evident in this video that the Coach got as much as a warning. Not good.
Ok...this is what I saw...the runner on 2B was out due to the fielder tagging 3B. This was the 2nd out. The runner on 3B is out due to abandonment. This was the 3rd out.
@@stephenherring Correct but did you notice where that runner on 3B (at the start of the play) went? The 'force' at the play does not result in the 3rd out. The 3rd out was that 3B runner entering the dugout, thus 'abandonment'.
Greetings from Venezuela, what would you do in this situation: runner in second base there is a roling hit by the short stop, the runner in second goes out to third base and collides with the shortstop. It`s interference or obstruction?
if the shortstop is fielding a batted ball and the runner makes contact, thats interference on the runner(shes out) , dead ball, batter gets first base
Hey there. Thanks for these videos. I am new to officiating softball and because of a bad back I’m only going to be doing bases. Is there any instructional videos that would help me isolate the things I need to learn to do bases first. Because there is a lot to learn.
Good videos and explanation. Key words though, "still videos". Calling leaving early is difficult in many situations. Because of this, I tend to incorporate "advantage/disadvantage" into my judgement, when in doubt. I also use preventative officiating early in the game by giving verbal warning(s) and communicating with the base coach(es); this way, if/when I call it, they all know I've already given a warning. As a field umpire, I'm also responsible for legal/illegal pitch, plus helping with check swings, etc. Tough job we have!
75 minute game?? Rule of thumb when timed games are played allows 15 minutes per inning. A 75 minute (1:15) time limit will likely create a 5 inning game (or less) which totally destroys the integrity of the game for athletes age 14 and older. An important part of the game begins to happen after 5 innings as pitchers tire and batters get a third and fourth plate appearance. Games for older players should not be timed at all, but in cases where they must be timed (as in travel ball settings), time limits should be a minimum of 1:45. Travel organizations should restore the integrity of the game and not be so worried about maximizing $$ by squeezing in as many teams as they possibly can on weekend tournaments!
@@mptr1783 High school and college games are "official" after 5 innings and are not continued at a later date if stopped before 7 innings for weather. Games are also shortened under various run rules. Official game length is 7 innings.
@@dogpatch75 Thanks for the insight. My point is that if MLB, NCAA BB play 9 innings, yet have a "complete game" as 5 innings, then your "integrity" theory isnt really valid. Id also argue that most pitchers who tire are pulled before 7 innings anyway
Second example shows why you need to emphasize wedge umpire is completely blocked from play. Example three with ball up the line umpire is way to far back...he takes a couple steps backwards which we should not be teaching
What the hell is a home plate umpire looking at? He's looking towards second base! How does he know if the runner touched the plate? He's halfway down the Third Base Line.
Yah in the Oklahoma game you could also have 1st baseman intentionally maliciously kicking the runner as well. That’s my judgement along with the other obvious wrapping her right on around the batter runner. Never seen any 1st baseman kick up there leg on a wild throw to 1st. Now the other rule with runner coming into any bag excluding 1st base is interference if they do not slide at the base cannot bulldoze there way running into home plate for example on a obvious play catcher clearly has ball the runner is 2 and a half strides away and comes in standing can we cover this rule also which is new or has been out now a couple years
Or not...only one fielder is protected, if the umpire rules third baseman is the protected fielder it is not interference...and that is a 100% judgement call not appealable or protestable
As usual, the NCAA went stupid. Nearly every other rule book treats lines the same way in that the ball or foot has to be completely outside the line to be foul, out of play, or out of the box. This is what happens when you let coaches write the rules.
Looked to me like the runner was leaning in to throw a shoulder and the catcher just fended her off. Any crashing and burning was due to the runner's own momentum. The runner had a path to the plate without contacting the catcher.
@@nicoleallie7545 Obstruction is a judgement call. If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen. The catcher has to leave a path to the plate. It doesn't have to be big enough to drive a truck through it. Both of those players had a path and leaned into the catcher on purpose. It's their own fault that they ended up in the dirt.
@@tannhauser7584 " If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen." That's an idiotic statement. You can clearly see obstruction, it doesn't just vanish because the umpire didn't call it. This catcher was punished by her school district for her actions. If you are an umpire, you are most likely very bad.
@@nicoleallie7545 I'm not talking about your reality. I'm talking about the reality on the field. If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen. Try convincing him otherwise.
I don't understand...if the fielder enters the running lane what is the runner supposed to do??? But yes it was certainly malicious but can it not be argued that it was obstruction??? Pardon me for asking I've been out of the game since COVID...
The batter-runner is only required to run in the lane if there is a throw from a fielder to first. In this situation the runner is expected to run outside the lane to avoid the fielder.
The running lane is in use for a thrown ball most commonly during a bunt or uncaught third strike where one player will be throwing the ball at some angle up the foul line to first. The runner is afforded protection in this case if in the running lane if they are hit by the throw. In this case we have a batted ball. The running lane does not afford protection from a batted ball situation. The fielder has first right to field the ball. The runner must allow that right. In this case, there is mo established baseline so the runner can go right or left as far as they need to avoid interference.
I'm sorry, but what the hell is this ump doing? How he doesn't have his left arm extended with a closed fist and calling obstruction is beyond me. But he waits for the runner to actually be able to touch the plate to call her safe. I know that she legally still has to touch, but damn. Read a rule book, dude.
This sucks..bcuz she had the ball before making contact with runner which i think is legal
Youngs out there if a catcher squats like that, slide feet first and make sure both your feet make contact with hes/her chest...is perfectly legal
In second video clip, runner left second base early and should have been called out.
The first batter should be ejected
I disagree with the Obstruction interpretation for the 2nd play with the catcher and the pay at the plate. This is not an obvious obstruction call. My judgement is that the ball was obtained just before the contact with a runner. The runner was never impeded (veer, stutter, change direction, slow down, contact made , etc.) until after the catcher caught the ball. Once the defender has possession of the ball, and no prior impedance occurred, there is no more obstruction to consider. Being that the runner continued the whole way without being impeded and the contact on that play happened after the catcher obtained the ball (or at least almost simultaneously and you have to slow down the video to see it), I would judge (seeing it at full speed) this as a legal play.
No place in softball for poor sports like that.
In this situation, because the pop up ball was near the foul line, the umpire would declare "infield fly if fair". If it's the ball is on the foul side of the line when caught, then there would not be an infield fly rule in affect and the batter would not be instantly out. The catch would need be made in foul territory for the batter to be out. The umpire has to wait to see where the the ball is in relation to the foul line to make a determination. Since this ball was in fair territory when touched or caught, then the infield fly rule would be in affect and the batter would be called out and be considered a retired runner. My question is: While the umpire waits to determine if the infield fly will be in affect (due to the ball being near the foul line), the batter is still not technically out until such determination is made. As she can still run and is a legal batter runner until the determination is made and if the determination is made to be an infield fly at the moment of contact between the batter runner and the fielder, then could that batter runner be considered as being a live legal runner at the moment of contact and only the batter runner would be called out and all other runners return to their former bases from the time of the pitch? Because the pop up ball is near the foul line, the batter runner could actually interfere with the fielder prior to the infield fly being determined. Does that timing of everything happening matter? Thanks.
3rd.example the batter actually touches the bag before the tag is applied
Just a thought but if they were taught to slide at home regardless of the play this could be prevented?
Bases loaded. 1 Out. 3rd baseman touches 3rd. Runner on 3rd is safe as there was no tag and runner coming from 2nd is out because of a force play. 2 outs Throw home nets zero outs as it was no longer a force play. Throw back to 3rd with the tag on the runner coming from 2nd still nets no outs because that runner was already out from the touching of 3rd base force out The runner on 3rd assumes she was out so she makes herself out by walking to the dugout. Inning over The runner from 3rd tries to go and touch home plate after the fact, run shouldn't count because at this point way out of the base paths and gave herself up earlier by going to the dugout. Inning still over.
NCAA...can't block the plate without possession of the ball. I would call this in NFHS as soon as that runner slowed and adjusted her path.
A classic example of obstruction.
Pop up slide into the thrower at 2nd base. 2nd base throws ball into the stands. Easy call
3 man rotation is tough. The 1B umpire should have went out to get catch/no catch. Home plate should have moved towards third, but been close enough to make the call at home. Runner might have been out at home.
From this camera view it looks like she was safe. From the base ump view she was out. Coach obviously thought she was safe too, thats why he was not a happy camper.
It's not you. In this situation the inside umpire has fly ball responsibilities from the left fielder to the right fielder. It is referred to as the "Cone". The 1B umpire has from the right fielder to the fence and the PU has from the left fielder to the fence. Properly executed, the 1B umpire goes out to rule on fair/foul, catch/no catch, and dead ball/live ball. Once he goes out, he stays out. Once he does that the other two umpires revert to two-man mechanics. The 3B umpire comes inside the diamond and has primary responsibility for first and second base. The PU has primary responsibility for 3B and home. The PU also stays outside the diamond. All three of them blew the coverage.
2:40 can be used for leaving early as well.
Thanks for posting!
Agree with rejection that should have been assigned...and agree with the comment on...What was the umpire doing/looking at??? If it was the winning inning I would recommend she be rejected for the season or at least the next game.
IF that coach had taught her catcher to properly position herself at home plate on this type of play, she would have had a shot at cleanly catching the throw and making a tag... Absolutely NO offensive interference...
Bad optics is an understatement - calling foul then HR - but appealing (more like arguing) Coach should have been ejected after continuing to argue after all officials gathered and rendered a final decision. I'm not even sure it's evident in this video that the Coach got as much as a warning. Not good.
Is it me, or did ZERO umpires cover 3B and witness R1 touching the base? It seems it would have been better for U1 "going" to cover a tough catch.
What we looking for this video
Pretty easy call....
The music detracts from an otherwise outstanding video.
Rules ladies...rules.😄
Ok...this is what I saw...the runner on 2B was out due to the fielder tagging 3B. This was the 2nd out. The runner on 3B is out due to abandonment. This was the 3rd out.
The force at the plate was off after 3rd base was tagged.
@@stephenherring Correct but did you notice where that runner on 3B (at the start of the play) went? The 'force' at the play does not result in the 3rd out. The 3rd out was that 3B runner entering the dugout, thus 'abandonment'.
Greetings from Venezuela, what would you do in this situation: runner in second base there is a roling hit by the short stop, the runner in second goes out to third base and collides with the shortstop. It`s interference or obstruction?
if the shortstop is fielding a batted ball and the runner makes contact, thats interference on the runner(shes out) , dead ball, batter gets first base
Isn’t that second one obstruction
Hey there. Thanks for these videos. I am new to officiating softball and because of a bad back I’m only going to be doing bases. Is there any instructional videos that would help me isolate the things I need to learn to do bases first. Because there is a lot to learn.
Man…looks so easy with stills…but really hard in real time. Rarely have a straight look through.
Good videos and explanation. Key words though, "still videos". Calling leaving early is difficult in many situations. Because of this, I tend to incorporate "advantage/disadvantage" into my judgement, when in doubt. I also use preventative officiating early in the game by giving verbal warning(s) and communicating with the base coach(es); this way, if/when I call it, they all know I've already given a warning. As a field umpire, I'm also responsible for legal/illegal pitch, plus helping with check swings, etc. Tough job we have!
You say nothing about obstruction
75 minute game?? Rule of thumb when timed games are played allows 15 minutes per inning. A 75 minute (1:15) time limit will likely create a 5 inning game (or less) which totally destroys the integrity of the game for athletes age 14 and older. An important part of the game begins to happen after 5 innings as pitchers tire and batters get a third and fourth plate appearance. Games for older players should not be timed at all, but in cases where they must be timed (as in travel ball settings), time limits should be a minimum of 1:45. Travel organizations should restore the integrity of the game and not be so worried about maximizing $$ by squeezing in as many teams as they possibly can on weekend tournaments!
and yet an official game is 5 innings.
@@mptr1783 High school and college games are "official" after 5 innings and are not continued at a later date if stopped before 7 innings for weather. Games are also shortened under various run rules. Official game length is 7 innings.
@@dogpatch75 Thanks for the insight. My point is that if MLB, NCAA BB play 9 innings, yet have a "complete game" as 5 innings, then your "integrity" theory isnt really valid. Id also argue that most pitchers who tire are pulled before 7 innings anyway
Outside the box violation under NCAA rules, no violation under NFHS rules.
Second example shows why you need to emphasize wedge umpire is completely blocked from play. Example three with ball up the line umpire is way to far back...he takes a couple steps backwards which we should not be teaching
What the hell is a home plate umpire looking at? He's looking towards second base! How does he know if the runner touched the plate? He's halfway down the Third Base Line.
That's PAINFUL
thats interference in every jurisdiction being played today. baseball all levels, softball slow pitch and fast pitch, even 16 inch softball
First scenario is a perfect example of obstruction. Sitting on the plate without the ball?
Yah in the Oklahoma game you could also have 1st baseman intentionally maliciously kicking the runner as well. That’s my judgement along with the other obvious wrapping her right on around the batter runner. Never seen any 1st baseman kick up there leg on a wild throw to 1st. Now the other rule with runner coming into any bag excluding 1st base is interference if they do not slide at the base cannot bulldoze there way running into home plate for example on a obvious play catcher clearly has ball the runner is 2 and a half strides away and comes in standing can we cover this rule also which is new or has been out now a couple years
Out for interfering with the defensive player
You are not going to see a clearer case of obstruction literally sitting in front of home plate without the ball....REALLY??
Interference
Or not...only one fielder is protected, if the umpire rules third baseman is the protected fielder it is not interference...and that is a 100% judgement call not appealable or protestable
$45 for 90min ! And you still have umpires.
So, on this mechanic, I could be moving on a possible diving catch?
As usual, the NCAA went stupid. Nearly every other rule book treats lines the same way in that the ball or foot has to be completely outside the line to be foul, out of play, or out of the box. This is what happens when you let coaches write the rules.
Looked to me like the runner was leaning in to throw a shoulder and the catcher just fended her off. Any crashing and burning was due to the runner's own momentum. The runner had a path to the plate without contacting the catcher.
Are you kidding us or are you just the uneducated about softball. The catcher had ZERO right to be there. She committed obstruction.
@@nicoleallie7545 Obstruction is a judgement call. If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen. The catcher has to leave a path to the plate. It doesn't have to be big enough to drive a truck through it. Both of those players had a path and leaned into the catcher on purpose. It's their own fault that they ended up in the dirt.
@@tannhauser7584 " If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen." That's an idiotic statement. You can clearly see obstruction, it doesn't just vanish because the umpire didn't call it. This catcher was punished by her school district for her actions. If you are an umpire, you are most likely very bad.
@@nicoleallie7545 I'm not talking about your reality. I'm talking about the reality on the field. If the ump didn't call it, it didn't happen. Try convincing him otherwise.
I don't understand...if the fielder enters the running lane what is the runner supposed to do??? But yes it was certainly malicious but can it not be argued that it was obstruction??? Pardon me for asking I've been out of the game since COVID...
The batter-runner is only required to run in the lane if there is a throw from a fielder to first. In this situation the runner is expected to run outside the lane to avoid the fielder.
The running lane is in use for a thrown ball most commonly during a bunt or uncaught third strike where one player will be throwing the ball at some angle up the foul line to first. The runner is afforded protection in this case if in the running lane if they are hit by the throw. In this case we have a batted ball. The running lane does not afford protection from a batted ball situation. The fielder has first right to field the ball. The runner must allow that right. In this case, there is mo established baseline so the runner can go right or left as far as they need to avoid interference.
shes got to avoid a fielder fielding a batted ball, so yes, she must run around her, stop or whatever it takes to avoid interfering
I'm sorry, but what the hell is this ump doing? How he doesn't have his left arm extended with a closed fist and calling obstruction is beyond me. But he waits for the runner to actually be able to touch the plate to call her safe. I know that she legally still has to touch, but damn. Read a rule book, dude.