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@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Wow, I didn't notice this until you wrote this comment. But yeah it is similar, i may check if other E6Ms will made the same noise or it is just this particular one.

@WingChan100 I was thinking I should do that too. It would be interesting to find out if there are more like this.

@DaniThePancakeWarrior Some of the older units of E6M (ZF) making some kind of weird noise too.

@@WingChan100 What does the noise sound like? Have you never heard it before on an E6X?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes, never heard on E6X. I would guess is the exhaust pipe sound.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior 9:47 that's probably a very small slope on it, but i still react like that😂😂. Ecomat i would love to hear when the changing from gear 2 to 3, i enjoy that a lot especially without topodyn.

@@WingChan100 Lol, they sometimes do that on the small slopes too, yeah. That 2-3 Ecomat sound makes me laugh sometimes. 1-3 is my favourite for those.

The gear 2 to 3 sound often suits the axle sound as well, for me.

@DaniThePancakeWarrior I onboard this particular E50D recently, sadly no more these sound.

@@WingChan100 I understand - back to normal, for this ATENU. How long did it have that kickdown mod for?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, finally more 60FPS video. 1:46 i would say caused by the driver didn't fully press the throttle. 10:10 as i remember, there's traffic ahead so the driver have to stay behind it (probably a Voith E50D on rt.42C) AMC I didn't have recording on this particular slope. But i do have ASC ASB and even AVC recording.

@@WingChan100 Okay. If you want, you can send me those recordings and I can see if I have listened to them before.

@DaniThePancakeWarrior I believe only very small part of it are really uploaded to TH-cam. Maybe i will do it in future. Most of it uploaded could be 74A, the AMC never have a recording on this slope.

@@WingChan100 74A, yes - you filmed lots of RLEs on that route. Does this mean that I saw the same slope in that recent video of ASC29?

@DaniThePancakeWarrior It depends, some of video recording on opposite direction (which mean heading to Tai Po) which actually have more giant slope than ASC29 that video(heading Kowloon)

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior 😂😂😂 It is actually quite often to hear this kind of sound in HK. Since the driver on this rt mostly will floor the bus😂.

@@WingChan100 That makes sense, since drivers often need to downshift to cope with the slopes as well. I sometimes hear this happen with the ZF gearbox, but it seems more common to me with the Voith ones.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, i did heard that on ZF gearbox in the past but rarely.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior th-cam.com/video/LeHPIzNDBmM/w-d-xo.html ATENU1431 verison of "Voith panic attack"😂 at 09:47

@@WingChan100 Lol, you filmed that bus on the 80 and 277E on the same day?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes it is Euro 5. I think this doesn't sounds as good as the Euro 4 one. I would prefer Euro 4 units since they got nice ecomat sound and more importantly a kickdown switch.

@@WingChan100 I understand how you feel. The ASUDs also have no kickdown, as well? I also noticed, even without kickdown, it is not as quick as the ASUs, but they also have a bit less power anyway. Other countries have some Euro5 ones with a loud gearbox and a kickdown switch. I like both; sometimes I prefer Euro4 and sometimes Euro5. Usually when I don't hear Euro4 Scanias for a while, I miss them, and the same for Euro5 ones.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, no kickdown unless the driver apply with foot work. Not as powerful as Euro4 units, they're only 280hp. Emmmm, the Euro5 one using Ecolife gearbox, it is much less fun that Ecomat in my options.

@@WingChan100 Some Euro5 Ecolife Scanias have kickdown too, but I haven't heard of any as loud as the Ecomats.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, so as some Ecolife B8Ls. Some of them got Loud ecolife.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, it happen mostly on ATEEs and ATEUs. I think this is related to the engine, since after the monthly check the sound become normal. Some ATENUs does have same issue, but not much.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, I think so too. Wow, it's still hard for me to believe KMB check buses that often, when some UK buses can be left with low adblue for many months.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I think KMB just average when talking about maintenance. I would say the MTRB have the best maintenance in HK. Even though their units operate for over 10+ years nowadays, I don't even saw any rust on the wheel. For the adblue, it does happened before. While it affects performance a lot, they drive it back to depot for refill adblue tank or simply just change another bus.

@@WingChan100 Really? It sounds average for HK buses is better than average for UK buses, to me. MTRB have less buses than KMB, right?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes, MTRB own way less buses than KMB and CTB. I think that's because people in HK require higher standard. People in HK always complain about it even that it is rare to onboard a broken bus😂.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes it is. This one got a nice ZF sound. Performance is ok, but I can't say it is the best one. I've also got some recording with kickdowns on it, sound lively for me. It is sad that they are retired now.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, for a B10TL, I think it was alright. I know how you feel. It's good that you have recorded many memories.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, B10TLs and B10Ts are my best memories. Oh and the AVW series is the first buses equip with wright body in HK.

@@WingChan100 It's like that for me with the Volvo B7TL and the Wright Eclipse Gemini. I think the Gemini and Explorer were the first WrightBus double decker vehicles, but I think the UK had Wright Renown buses with B10BLE before those.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I think they looks cool. But it is too heavy for a bus body, it even affect the performance and safety issue.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior 5:04 that's the gas station, usually the taxi will refuel before they hand it in for next driver. Yes, i do stopped the video at tunnel, since i'm ready to get off this terrible bus😂. As i say, these single decker Scania is the WORST ever. The driver driver "carefully" due to the extremely poor suspension. If the driver doesn't apply with footwork, i would say it must be slow and disappointed. However, some of them do have nice ecomat sound and weird screaming gearbox.

@@WingChan100 "ready to get off this terrible bus" 🤣 Okay, so that gas station is frequently used by taxis? Even in my opinion, they don't look very nice inside. I think I was able to notice the poor suspension, although I don't remember very well. I agree with what you said about the gearbox on some of them. This ASC looked like it should not have been on the road. But, for me, it's funny to think that I have been on a lot of UK buses as slow as this ASC.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, terrible. If you ever have a chance come to HK, avoid these terrible buses. Yep, since taxis in HK use LPG so they use longer time to fill up their tank than the pertrol car. Well, these ASC i dont think KMB would love to care a lot about it. Since it only use for some rt with low demand which doesn't have many people complain on it.

@@WingChan100 You sound so serious about it. I love that. 🤣 Oh, okay. It's been a long time since I last heard about LPG. I only remember what the letters mean. That's true...although I personally wouldn't put an ASC on a route with lots of slopes to climb. At least it gets the job done, though.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, it is very comfortable for everyone. But well, at least it is a bus😂. I think not much places using LPG car now😂. While HK use a lot on taxi and minibus.

Yes, it is. I would have same idea as you, it sounds like unusual. Not "pure" enough for me😂

@@WingChan100 😂

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I recommend you to listen this (the much older recording of ATEU45). It reallty sounds like elephant😂. th-cam.com/video/fH21oLMMxbc/w-d-xo.html

@@WingChan100 Okay. I'll listen to that when I have some time. (I probably should have seen this before thinking about ASC29. lol)

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Wow😂 I didn't know you are interested on those Scania.

Yeah, this particular ATEE is pretty intesting on the gearbox setting. I think only this ATEE will did like that in 1:52, but it is pretty bad in my opinion. Definitely, B10TLs got a kickdown button. It actually do have some B10TLs operate on this route in the past.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, it just sounds sad. 😂 Yes, I think I've seen your recordings of Volvos on this route before.

@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, some B9TLs.

Yeah, it is 60fps. In the past i use to not shot with 60fps since it take much more space. But now it is all 60fps. However, i may drop frame on some of to video since it is overheating a lot. That's right, definitely a kickdown. Sometimes i add highlights in this description. For some reason, it didn't save. Oh, and additional information. This route is no longer in service too. Replaced by the express service rt 241X.

@@WingChan100 I understand. That's alright. Yeah. That's okay. Sometimes, kickdown gets used so much in a video that it can be fine without the timestamps, so I didn't mind. 10:48 was my favourite in this video. That reminds me of the 58 and 258 being similar, and many others. What is the difference between them?

​@@DaniThePancakeWarriorrt 241X use highway instead of cheng sha wan road. Yeah, i mean most of the driver on this route will floor the bus as well. Since that's a long long rt.

@@WingChan100 Did the 41 have the same two termini as the 241X? It sounds like the 41 was even longer than this one, unless the 241X has an extension since it uses the highway. (I like that you also use the phrase "floor the bus" - I can relate to it)

@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yep, same terminal. 41 have more stops than 241X. 241X using the highway to skip those stops along cheung sha wan, while 41 use cheung sha wan road which is just a regular road with 50kph speed limit plus lot of stops.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, especially on these ex-LWB units. That's affirmative, i just forget about it damn.

@@WingChan100 Some of the ATENUs are also from LWB? I didn't know that; that's interesting. It's alright. I just found it funny. I remember when I saw you only uploaded one video, and then I saw you upload a video on the next day earlier than usual. Then when I saw you uploaded two more, I realised, "Yeah, Wing must've forgotten. 😂"

​@@DaniThePancakeWarriorYes, that's correct. And they do have two types, one with regular seats and one with luxury seats, just like the CTB cityflyer one. But they're now all came to KMB. I have heard five of those will be convert to a open top one. Haha, usually i scheduled each day for one audio and video. But i missed yesterday accidentally 😂.

@@WingChan100 I think I have seen one with the regular seats on an LWB route before. The luxury seats are wide at the back, downstairs. Yeah, I usually see one audio and one video each day. Sometimes, I forget to press to confirm the time, and then the video gets scheduled for 00:00 midnight.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior yes, and with bigger legroom too. I set to midnight just because it is easier to manage. I mean TH-cam did this many times, hard to believe they didn't fix that.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Haha, that's my first time too.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, but sadly it still have topodyn enabled.

@@WingChan100 Which ones do you know are currently not using topodyn?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior If you talking about ATEE, currently only ATEE3 11 14 17 20 21 26 36 39 40. I do have lot of recording on these beast, but i just dont have that much time to upload it all right now. They sounds excellent by the way, music for me😂.

@@WingChan100 10 ATEEs - not bad, although it looks like there are a lot more with topodyn. Yeah, that's okay. You give us a variety of buses, and this means that we get ATEE videos across many years. Sometimes I see an ATE video and I have to remember, "Wait, this is an old video. They're not still in service," but it's nice to hear them again.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior In fact, some of the ATEEs operate without topodyn for a while before. But they re-enabled again after the monthly check. ATEs and AVWs, as i remeber these recording at least 2 to 3 years old now. Record during the covid pandemic. The pandemic actaully kill a lot old buses, otherwise it probably still in service right now.

Honestly, I forget what sound is that😂

@@WingChan100 It seemed so random to me. lol I think it was someone's ringtone.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, probably. Since quite a lot people using weird ringtone😂

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior lol😂

Yes, it is. The ATE209 got a very loud turbo in the past, they fixed before it retired.

That's great! Glad to hear you enjoy with the recordings.

@@WingChan100 I listen to these recordings almost every day. Sometimes I have ideas for a comment to write on your other videos, but I don't give myself enough time to write them.

Wow, i didn't expected that. Thank you for your ideas as well👍 But for me, i would say the ATEE without topodyn is my favorite now. something like this: th-cam.com/video/dJiOSongryQ/w-d-xo.html

@@WingChan100 Yes. They help me focus on my work. That's okay. Whenever I have time, I'll try to share my thoughts about your recordings. Yep, I have seen that recording too. I also liked that ATEE.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior That's great if those recording can help. As always, relax is more important than everything for me.

I think so, since i have heard this type of noise from other ASVs.

@@WingChan100 I have heard this noise from a lot of buses in the UK - mostly Enviro400s and some older Geminis - but not many in your videos (maybe you just get a lot of good buses). Maybe I'll try to notice that sound more if I hear it during your other journeys.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Oh wow. It acutally appeared in some of the Voith AVBEs and ATENUs. But never heard the belt noise from a AVBWUs.

@@WingChan100 That's interesting. It sounds like it was common for ADL bodies.

Yeah, that's correct. Wright body are better in general (quality).

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior That's correct. If the driver put their foot down to the switch while realising quickly will result something like 1:01:29. Mostly, driver will use the kickdown switch on some slopes or startup at busy road.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior th-cam.com/video/cf8v-T5wXbc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=sMR6Erl5Sye55hLH Demonstration of kickdown on the B10TLs.

@@WingChan100 I understand. Maybe there wasn't enough space to go fast enough. Apparently, some switches are harder to use than others. Have you ever heard of a faulty kickdown switch before? I'll remember that link for later. I'm also listening to ASV89 right now.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I do hear some switches are harder to use. But a faulty one? Never heard about it As i know some of their switches are being removed by KMB.

@@WingChan100 That's interesting. Yeah, I've never heard of a faulty one, either - just switches being removed like you said.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Quite a lot of them have turbo leak issue, even in the past (AVWs).

@@WingChan100 Does that happen specifically with buses from the depot operating the 277X, or is that happening with other buses from other depots?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior From every depot, this is quite common for HK buses. Even the citybus have the same turbo leak issue. But i would say it is some very minior problem. Some of it even got very loud turbo sound, which shows that it leak quite a lot.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, I agree - it's usually not too bad. It has been a while since I have heard a bus with a loud turbo leak in the UK, but I used to hear it a lot in previous years.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Oh wow. I would love pure engine sound more as well.

Just around 5 years now.

Yeah, it actually operate with quite a lot ZF ATEs and AVBWs in the past. Sadly, it now mostly operate with Voith ISL ATENUs.

@@WingChan100 Oh, that's right - now I remember you said that last time, with the 38 now using Voith ATENUs instead.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, so i rarely onboard 38 now.

@@WingChan100 Ah. Is that one of those routes that you ride to record specific buses?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yep, in the past. Since there are more "old buses" operate on this highway plus hill climb route.

Usually, i seldom record B8Ls with Gemini 3 body now. Since they only have clear sound in winter.

@@WingChan100 Oh. They sound different during the winter?

Lower bass sound compare to the MCV units. I believe it is related to the sound isolation problem .

@@WingChan100 They have a lower bass sound in the winter than MCV? Or the Gemini has a sound isolation problem when it's cold, so it sounds clearer in the winter?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior yes, in winter.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior The difference is theit maximum input torque. "604C" have higher maximum input torque than "504C'

@@WingChan100 Ohh, wow. I wasn't expecting that. Torque is something that I have not understood very well, but I understand what you mean. So, this ATEE's gearbox would have more torque than the Enviro400s in the UK with ZF Ecomat. I have seen something with Ecolife that has confused me. I sometimes see 6AP1203B, and sometimes I just see 6AP1200B (or maybe it's 1300B; I can't remember if 6AP1300B is what the ZF ATENUs have).

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yep, as HK require to have better high climbing performance. The ZF ATENUs use 6AP1700B, the 1403B use on AVBWUs instead.

@@WingChan100 That sounds funny to me, but I think that makes sense since I think the AVBWUs are more powerful anyway. Still, I wonder why it's 1403 instead of 1400.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior As I remember, this journey was driven by a bus enthusiast.

@@WingChan100 Haha, that's interesting.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, it is way too noisy as well. I'm actually on a B7RLE at this moment while replying your comment 😂.

@@WingChan100 Lol, yes - they're all noisy. There was one Euro5 one I had with the Wright Eclipse body that was just as noisy as your AVCs.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior As I heard these AVCs use some chinese parts, that's why they have such loud turbo sound. For the vibration sound, i dont know why at all 😂.

@@WingChan100 That's something I think I would notice as well, the louder turbo sound. Yeah, for me, I would often say these AVCs sound goofy. KMB ordered a lot of them too, although it's not like 1000 ATENUs.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, a lot of them. Recently some of them was sold to other companies, including the AVC2 PE5856, which is the only AVC pair with Ecomat gearbox.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior ASVs and AVWs both are my favourite. But i would prefer wright body for myself. ASVs and 3ASVs generally have better performance than AVWs since they have a lighter body.

@@WingChan100 Now I remember, yes. One time, I think you told me that the AVWs being heavy is one reason why they are slower than the other double deckers in HK.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, and more important is they are easier to lose the balance while turning too fast.

@@WingChan100 Oh. I guess WrightBus didn't test that very well? It makes sense why I don't usually hear AVWs reach 5th gear.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Wright Explorer body, the first generation of wright body. Reaching 5 gear only at 70kph, usually a small slope will focus it back to gear 4 inorder to speed up again.

No foot work applied on this recording. Since this ATEE got an Hill Climbing Mode .

@@WingChan100 Okay, that sounds more accurate.

The only similar is that they are both sai kung district route. Other than that, they're heading to completely different destination. M at the back mean they're designed to use as a shuttle bus between MTR station or some popular location.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, that makes sense. I imagine that some of the other "90" routes also go to Sai Kung, but then they go elsewhere. I understand the "M" now. I think another route you film is 59M? So that route also has a terminus at an MTR station?

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yeah, the Tsuen Wan MTR Station. In the past, since Tuen Mun district don't have any MTR service.So they create this route use for connecting Tuen Mun and Tsuen Wan district.

@@WingChan100 That is a good connection.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes, it is. Since i think left side can hear more than right side.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, that sounds right.

You're correct, there's a turbo leak in this AVBW. As i know this haven't fix until it's final day on service. Yes, it is. Since after 12:16 there's a seat available on right side which can have a better place for recording. Sadly, this AVBW retired in May. There's only one AVBW still in service right now. I'm guessing it will be retired soon.

@@WingChan100 Maybe its MOT was updated later than the others. I don't really know, but there is a similar situation with an operator in the south of England, who has only one Gemini from 2001 still in service.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I believe it is due to the shortage of buses in that particular depot. Since another AVBW64 was broken in June and they decided to not fix it.

Yes, it can when the bus have no load with good condition. However, I believe in this highlight there was a small down slope on it couple with driver full throttle.

@@WingChan100 Hmm. Were those AVWs just really tired during their final years with KMB?

It did have, before the covid and they retired very early.

@@WingChan100 I wonder if they were as fast as the AVBWUs when they were brand new.

​@@DaniThePancakeWarriorNo, since they use different setting when they're brand new. As I know it is pretty slow.

Yes, most of them perform well and sound nice. One of them even hv kickdown enabled (ATE186) which i have onboard for few times. That one sounds excellent for me, definitely my favourite.

@@WingChan100 I was wondering about that, how they would sound with kickdown. If you have it on your channel, I'll see if I can find it some time soon.

I have one only, but i didn't upload to TH-cam yet.

@@WingChan100 That's alright.

Yeah, you're correct. Originally i was planned to record some weird engine sound on this particular E6X, but i didn't know they fixed that fast😂.

@@WingChan100 Hey, that's good maintenance. The maintenance of some buses I've been on has been consistently poor for ages.

Definitely eco-mode, i was told by other bus enthusiast that this AVBWU do not have hill climb mode. In a result, it perform extremely poor. AVBWU212 is a completely different story. It can easily activate hill climb mode as well.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, 212 performed very well.

This ATEE use eco-mode, that's why the driver need to use foot work. Yeah, with eco mode i consider is a good one.

Yeah, a big slope. However, it is not a circular route.

Yeah, this one sounds good for me as well.Since the driver is bus enthusiastic so he know when to rev. I notice the vibrations too, but it seems normal. Some of them have the same vibrations as well, but i dont know why as they're brand new at that moment. Oh yeah, rt.92 again. But some interesting things happend, when i travelling back towards kowloonI actaully meet the same driver and onboard E6M146 again😂.

@@WingChan100 Heh, that's cool that he likes buses too, and that you met him again. Did you meet him towards Kowloon on the same day, or more recently? I've heard some people say that ADL bodywork often isn't the best, so maybe it's related to that.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Sadly no, since i didn't take rt.92 oftenly. That's actaully the common problem with HK ADL buses which due to poor installation of body.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, many enthusiasts say the same about UK ADL buses.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Wow, are they not build in UK? Since HK ADL buses are build in Zhuhai (China).

Mostly AVBWUs and sometimes with AVBEs and ATENUs. I actually onboard this rt today with AVBWU614.

@@WingChan100 Haha, of course you did. It's nice to know that KMB still put AVBWUs on the route.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior they're pretty "new" as is it Euro5.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, that part makes sense. It's just that, sometimes companies move buses like these (not too young) to other routes so that they can put newer ones on it. Some companies in London have gotten rid of some Euro5 buses from their fleet entirely.

​@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Seems like pretty much same around the world. That's why KMB are retiring those D9As more quickly as it is Euro3. Replaced by new D8Ks, L9s and of course the EVs.

Yep, it is fan noise. I remember it is from the a/c unit. You're correct, it perform pretty well. I've uploaded another video for this AVBWU operate on rt.8 which is a hill climbing route with full throttle.

@@WingChan100 Okay. I'll take a look at that one some time.

Yes, it is topodyn eco mode with hill climb mode as well. It is pretty slowe indeed.

@@WingChan100 Oh, it still has hill-climbing mode? Interesting. It's kind of set-up like a B9TL.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior Yes, they do. But only with topodyn enabled. Those removed topodyn I didn't seen they have this kind of stuff. Since they already have kickdown enabled as well.

@@WingChan100 Yeah, the one difference is that the ATEEs were built with kickdown. That's interesting though, since not even the D9A B9s have kickdown either. It's like Volvo didn't want the B9TL to have it.

@@DaniThePancakeWarrior I'm not sure if they built with kickdown at frist, since nowadays both ATEUs and ATEEs have kickdown enabled and topodyn disabled as well. The D9As I'm not sure as well, since at first they installed the topodyn and sensotop as well. But due to the poor performance, eventually they removed those stuff.