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@@Mathmos252 not the worst price for a 3650 I don't think

@@Nikson2981 Ouch! Wish you hadn't scrapped it, the TL-340 is a drive I have desperately wanted to get a hold of for years, even broken! I would have absolutely loved to have had it, even just for parts. What a shame. Was there any appreciable difference between it and the TL-226 you see here, other than 20MB vs 30MB (4 vs 6 heads)?

@@TheDiskMaster sounded way different. i took a recording with my cellphone of it with the cover off before getting rid of it though. kind of a shame, totally would have sent it to you if i kept it

​@@Nikson2981I see. Did you upload it anywhere? I'd love to see! Maybe send it in the Discord?

old computers and hardware should never be recycled but instead sold on the open market

​@@ChronicKPOPGood luck getting most people to believe that.

@@francoisfritz198 Yep, I have several of these drives and for the most part they all work. They're tough little suckers.

@@HTMLEXP I see, I did not know that. Interesting!

@@VonAggelby huh? What do you mean

@@CaelThunderwing IDESDI is not affected by the health of the drive, it relies on an odd set of heuristics based on information the controller provides about the current drive status. HDmotion is just picking up bad sectors.

Totally wrong. The drive is fine. Some bad blocks sure.

​@@timradde4328This.

@@maxtornogood As I have previously mentioned, IDESDI is not affected at all by the health of a drive. It works purely by a set of unusual heuristics based on data the controller's status register can return. What it's watching for sure write faults and attempting to detect a recalibration. These drives take a long time to recalibrate regardless of whether or not they're working.

You're just wrong.

​@@timradde4328I agree, but there's no need to be rude

It's just about the same as an early production ST-225. Sadly, these are pretty darn rare and I have to take what I can get with regards to spindles.

@@TheDiskMaster you got pretty nice one :)

​@@engineer359thanks

@@TheDiskMaster you welcome:)

​@@engineer359👍

Yup. This is an ST-225 with one platter and two heads removed.

@@MyComputerStudios_ Yes, this is a single platter early model ST-225.

@@leecremeans5446 Yes, but they only exist for 84 and 85, I believe.

@@ewhartiii Unfortunately, there is no way to do this without destroying the spindle motor. It is completely sealed.

@@joshua-pj3rd haha I wonder if they're related to the company.

@@TheDiskMaster I was kind of wondering the same thing it would be a total trip if it was because the population is under 3k

​@@joshua-pj3rdI kinda doubt it, I think LaPine was based in California, but I could be wrong

@@TheDiskMaster that would make more sense because LaPine Oregon is kind of just a little redneck Town / tourist trap is not much going on there

​@@joshua-pj3rdMaybe someone in the company had family there. Who knows.

@@BoraHorzaGobuchul no problem. Primarily here for the documentary efforts but to each their own!

@@TheDiskMaster brings back the childhood. Never had this particular drive but my 330meg scsci drive made similar sounds ) Down the memory lane

​@@BoraHorzaGobuchulInteresting, there were no drives >120MB that used stepping motors, so I'm not sure what that could have been.

@@TheDiskMaster "all you hdds sounds the same to me", or maybe there was. In my memory, it sounded similarly. But that was a long time ago. Don't remember the name, only that it had a black front panel, and a big green LED indicator, that it was scsci and 330mb volume it thereabouts

​@@BoraHorzaGobuchul Most drives with a front panel are black, and green LEDs were almost always an option. The design of that faceplate and the position of the light are what I would need to know to make an educated guess as to the model of drive. An easy example of not all drives sounding the same would be putting this Lapine next to any modern drive. They are audibly very different, that much is clear to anyone.

@@wahidtrynaheghugh260 Says who? We always have room in the server and in the community for another enthusiast, even if you don't become a collector!

Indeed, I have noticed that both this and the Kyocera KC-20A drives which share it's chassis have begun to have serious capacitor issues. I had heard they were sued, yes. The case doesn't appear to have been formally closed until the 2000s when it was largely irrelevant anyways. Love that legal system.

Had no idea that Kyocera manufactured these drives.

@@thegeforce6625 Lapine designed the KC-20B as well, as the LT-2000. 80scompaqpc is lucky enough to have one!

@@MyComputerStudios_ Because HDAT is a disk diagnostic program and is purposely looking for errors, and because HDMotion attempts to random read basically every sector on the drive. These drives are extremely rare and there is no reliable way for me to fix these errors, so if I want to demonstrate the drives, this is what I have to deal with.

@@TheDiskMaster I'm sure you are aware of this but sometimes it is worth a check of the cables/contacts of these drives. I have a MiniScribe 3650 that showed a bad head 3 when testing (attempted LLF), however before opening it I tried cleaning the contacts on the PCB and the drive actually booted without error (original LLF must have been on an AT class controller).

​@@bobjoe2827Sadly, if you watch the video closely, you will see that this is not the case. Errors on head 3 are consistent and only span cylinder 0 to 284. A poor connection would cause head 3 to never be legible, but this suggests an actual media error. This drive is very tired and came out of a warehouse.

IDESDI really does make some strange sounds, doesn't it?

@@TheDiskMasteryeah definitely.

@@thegeforce6625 It's trying to use some really simple heuristics based on data the controller hands back about the state of the drive in order to calculate it's geometry. It's a very interesting algorithm!

@@thegeforce6625 indeed! I wonder why Kyocera changed the firmware for the KC20A.

It was meant to be a portable drive, after all

@@bobjoe2827 Not sure which one has the damage here, I haven't opened it to look.

@@TheDiskMaster It looked like it failed on head 3, so it likely is the top platter (hopefully so as it is the easiest to fix). When I opened my drive, it wasn't a head crash, it was corrosion on the platter (a round spot in line with the lid vent, probably due to moisture).

​@@bobjoe2827Ouch, yeah, that'll do it. I haven't / probably won't open this drive, there's nothing I can do for it.

@@matthewsvideos8235 It happens

@@maxtornogood at cylinder 0, yeah.

@@aprilkolwey4779 I have seen that, but that change would invalidate test results for all previous drives.

@@TheDiskMaster Test of what? hdmotion doesn't report a score.

​​@@aprilkolwey4779If you time it with a stopwatch you get a time for the run, which is a good indicator of media health, rotational latency, and seek times. All important metrics I am documenting. You're getting 6 more minutes of sound anyways, statistics show that nobody watches more than about 2 minutes a time and I imagine the head crash sounds here will shorten that further. No reason to run the drive and possibly damage it by doing that.

Yes, there is damage around cylinder 0

@@TheDiskMaster how headcrash happen?

​@@engineer359The heads collided with the surface of the disk at some point. There's a large number of ways this could be caused.

@@TheDiskMaster thats pain

@@engineer359 Something like that

@@Kali_Krause only at cylinder 0

@@MyComputerStudios_ Seems to be

@@thegeforce6625 Probably exactly the same. There is no difference between a KL-320 and a KL-330 other than the certification done in the factory.

No, that's the sound of the stepping motor actuating the head stack.

@@TheDiskMaster i know lol Xd , i meant that It sounds like morse code😭😭😭

​@@Mathmos252Not really, there aren't any gaps or patterns to it. It would just be gibberish if any of it was decodable at all.

Indeed, but unfortunately these are rather rare and so this is the only one I could get my hands on that works.

Unfortunately yeah. Sadly the RLL variant here is very hard to get a hold of.

What do you mean?

@@TheDiskMaster For Example Arnol Doesn't Skip This Hdmotion But Why This Skip This

​@@HEFORCE.KHD4090Because it's very slow and time consuming.

@@BenM39435 Unfortunately, the sound is not likely to go away. The bearings are either dry or damaged or both. It's not too uncommon for these drives to get noisy in their old age!

Love these things

@@TheDiskMaster Will more of them appear?

​@@engineer359more Kaloks? In the future, yeah.

@@TheDiskMaster nice, i will wait for that to see

​@@engineer359They'll be lumped in with the rest of the IDE stuff when I get around to those

Yep, it happens. Sadly, this is the only functional KL-330 I could get my hands on, due to their rarity.

Yeah you mentioned that the other day in the discord

@@beanMosheen huh? No, this is the only swingarm drive I'm aware of which does NOT use a band positioner. This is rack and pinion.

@@mima85 very nice, this one was $15 tested working from an industrial supplier I often buy my drives from

@@TheDiskMaster It's cool to see that there's still someone selling those things at reasonable prices.

​@@mima85Indeed, it's lucky that I can still get them at all.

Isn't that the floppy drive?

@@Kali_Krause When did you see Windows 95?

@@thefumigator the floppy drive is active throughout the video, but there's nothing Windows related here

@@TheDiskMaster most likely MS-DOS, at the beginning. It doesn't say windows 95 anywhere, but people who drove windows 95 surely drove the DOS console, and might remember seeing it more than once during windows 95 problematic lifetime... Making them confused. Just a theory. Moreover his description of the sound, makes me think of the floppy, doesn't it?

​@@thefumigatorMS-DOS is running during the entire video. Why would Windows 95 be problematic? Yes, the floppy drive is active throughout the video as both the boot device and the primary storage where all my testing software resides.

It's listed as 3600 rpm

@@QuantumDriveEnjoyerQDE I don't know. Is there a way to tell for sure?

@@Kali_Krause everything I saw says 3600 yeah

TH99 lists it as 3048 rpm so does redhill and the value that speedsys says on mine is close to that. Even their early voice coil units also ran at a "strange" RPM

​@@arnlolInteresting. Maybe I'll have to put some reflective tape on the spindle and point a tachometer at it someday.

@@HEFORCE.KHD4090 okay

Yep that's my thoughts too

No this drive is probably junk

@@TheDiskMaster atleast this drive works, so we can hear its cool sounds

​@@engineer359works is an approximation at best lol

@@bobjoe2827 interesting, I've not attempted to repair this drive in any capacity. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't but this is the only real testing I've done for it at all

@@matthewsvideos8235 Not sure, I haven't done any testing outside of this video

@@arnlol yep sounds like a miniature ST-251 to me. I don't think it's ripped off but this drive has certainly seen better days.

@@bigbluebananabread agreed, I have a NOS one somewhere but I can't seem to find it. Doesn't help that my shelf collapsed. This drive was actually involved in a basement flood some years ago, I'm surprised it works as well as it does.

This drive has water damage, it was involved in a basement flood. I'm surprised it works at all with the amount of sand I pulled out of the filter element.

@@TheDiskMaster very lucky one, water mostly kills everything like that

​@@engineer359indeed

@@Teraforce88 it's certainly an unusual one that's for sure

@@Teraforce88 No, this drive doesn't even hardly have any bad sectors to speak of. It's as perfect as a Miniscribe can be.

@@TheDiskMasterI’d think that the seek errors would be related to stepper motor problems or it’s control logic on the drives PCB, atleast seeks shorter than about 100ms.

​@@thegeforce6625Unfortunately, no test I've ever performed has ever revealed an issue with the drive.

@@bobjoe2827 Yes, I talked that guy into selling me a huge lot of his most interesting drives. I actually have an NOS version of this drive laying around somewhere but I can't find it.

@@TheDiskMaster I know what you mean about not being able to find things, I'm getting there with computers and drives (I have already been there for years with vacuum tube electronics). A couple of years ago I bought a lot of 10 Seagate ST-351A/X hard drives from this seller and was only able to save 3 of them (they were well packaged, but mostly broken beyond repair). I made out as I was able to save 6 working boards from the bad drives, but still 30% is a dismal result.

​@@bobjoe2827ouch, yeah I bought untested drives from him just because they were highly unusual models. Microscience 7100 and stuff.

PTI stands for Peripheral Technology Inc, they sold controller cards which are fairly common. This was meant to be a contender for a portable drive, but was badly timed as PrairieTek had just released their 2.5" drive.