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I would agree with your assessment. A horse accustomed to working could easily travel 30 or 40 miles in a day. Part of my reckoning comes from a couple of things I've read about stage coaches and freight wagons used at the time. In the video I try to point out there is a wide range of anything from around twenty miles a day to upwards of 100 miles in a day. I will say that stage companies and Pony Express companies generally would limit their horses to around 15 to 20 miles in a day. I also wanted to state a conservative number, perhaps erring toward a lower number rather than the high side.

Sounds reasonable. I've not read that source but I've seen a number of sources pointing out how stage companies changed their teams at approximately 15 mile intervals. Those teams were expected to travel at a brisk walk or perhaps even a run and cover around 15 miles in 1.5 hours. The team would then be given the rest of the day for recovery. Thus one could travel by stage upwards of 100 miles in a 12 hour day. This allowed one to travel from say New York to Philadelphia in a day.

@@brentbiles451 exacly ...and lets not forget those people where toughf as hell not like us today pampered and with water in the house... well thank you for the info exchange

As a teen and younger man, I spent a few days moving cattle on horseback from atop a mesa to an adjacent pasture down the hill or nearer the house for branding. The roads up the mesas were often washed out making them difficult for the pickup, plus horses give you more flexibility when gathering strays etc... Part of my reckoning on the twenty mile number comes from those experiences. My grandfather didn't think it was a good idea to ride a horse more than a couple of hours before giving the animal a long break. Unfortunately, I didn't think to grill him with questions about what things were like before folks used pickups. I will say, however, he was conscious of his mounts and their well being. I'm not sure but it's my belief that men on cattle drives probably changed their mounts often and rarely spent an entire day on the same horse. I know a crew of six or eight cowboys would normally travel with a remuda of fifty or sixty horses. Cavalry riders, similarly, didn't normally ride more than two hours on the same mount. One of the biggest things I've tried to look at is what cowboys thought of as a work day. There is some evidence to suggest that cattle drivers would start early, maybe four or five in the morning, then stop by noon to allow their herds to graze and recover for the next day and avoid the hottest hours of the afternoon.

Yes I mention a couple of endurance competitions in the video, the Tevis Cup and Old Dominion Trail rides. Thanks for your input.

@@brentbiles451 - I forgot, LOL, that you had mentioned them. That was a good video. I have worked on horseback in the wilderness areas and backcountry of Idaho for decades and routinely rode 15 to 30 miles daily in very rugged, steep terrain. Also, I was performing a job on those trails with a packstring, which slowed me down.

Close, but no cigar. It's a "remuda" or a "string". 😂

In the video I point out there is a wide range of distances horses can travel. 20 miles is a conservative estimate to be sure. I think if you watch the entire segment you'll see I"ve shown how there is a wide range of distances. I even mention that the Comanche anedotally traveled up to 200 miles a day with multiple mounts, which seems like a ridiculously long ride to me.They must have been some tough ponies and riders.

Yes, I've read sources stating that cowboys on a lengthy cattle drive, from say San Antonio to Abilene in Kansas (around 700 miles), would change mounts every two hours. Those drives might take eight to ten weeks. The same sources also suggest the work day started very early, maybe four AM and ended around noon. I think those numbers could vary greatly however, depending upon the weather and which outfit you worked with. I will say that an average crew of six to eight cowboys, driving a herd of upwards of a thousand head of cattle, would travel with a remuda of fifty or sixty horses. Six to ten horses for every rider.

Sounds like a good pony. I based my 20 mile number on stage lines and cattle drives from that period. Most stage lines would change teams at around 15 mile intervals (around 90 minutes traveling at a gallop). Those teams would not work again that same day. Likewise cattle drives would travel with a remuda of around fifty horses for six to eight cowboys. Those men would change mounts three or four times in the course of a work day (Around 4:00 AM to Noon). Those drives wouldn't cover anything close to sixty miles in a day. Maybe twenty on a good day mainly because the cattle move slowly. As with everything there was a wide variance to how these outfits operated.

Travel 50 miles a day? Absolutely! Run 50 miles a day? Not a chance!

@nathanadrian7797 well documented. Look up ssma

@@nathanadrian7797 Dutch-R was the horses name

@@PahaPoniesSpanishMustangs Sorry my friend, but if you are claiming you know of a horse that could run(not trot) for 50 miles, then I must conclude that you are a tall tale teller, in search of a gullible audience.

@@nathanadrian7797 wanna race?

I actually mention that very fact (regarding the Comanche and their use of multiple mounts) in this video. As for my 'authority' I'm absolutely certain there are many many people more knowledgeable on this topic than I am. Nevertheless, I attempted to present a few facts. I thought long and hard about the average travel number of 20 miles, and decided to go with a very conservative estimate.

Thanks for the recommendations. If you're referring to Captain Jack Crawford, then yes I know of his work and have read excerpts. I look forward to checking out some of the other sources.

BTW, your comment "Not Really". Is that in response to some question I posed in the video? I don't claim to be an expert on horses or horsemanship, so apologies if I've gotten something dreadfully wrong here. From my research, there seems to be a wide range of distances a horse can cover. The 20 mile mark was meant to be a conservative number. At the other extreme it's clear other horses can travel a hundred miles a day. Hope you'll come back and check out some of my other videos.

@@brentbiles451 My comment "not really" was referring to your title "how far can a horse really travel in a day" and the introduction where you are dispelling myths of the old west. Cowboys frequently cover more than 20 miles in a day, even today. (My closest neighbor is 9 miles away.) Read the references I mentioned, and others, written by people who lived at the time and see what you learn. Agnes Morley Cleveland's book No Life for a Lady is also a very good read. You may find the U.S. Army 1944 manual on Pack Transportation, enlightening. You might enjoy the journey with them. The book The Cavalry Horse and His Pack, by 1st Lieut. Jno. J. Boniface, 4th Cavalry, 1908, states: "A horse of good endurance and clever at this gait will make from 6 to 7 miles an hour, and travel from 60 to 75 miles a day without great fatigue to himself or rider." and they still couldn't catch the Apache. After this research, you can decide if you have something dreadfully wrong in the video. Especially if you are dispelling myths.

@@sirronmitt Absolutely I agree. In my video I point out a number of exceptions to that number.

The support is much appreciated!

First thanks for the input. Just for reference. www.thespruce.com/buffalo-grass-7105718#:~:text=Buffalo%20grass%20(or%20buffalograss)%20is,and%2012%20inches%20in%20width.

I think we’re both right in this case. I do think buffalo grass can turf up. My personal experience with buffalo grass comes from pack camping in the high plains. Trying to find a comfortable spot to bed down on the clumpy ground isn’t possible. So I checked what you said and found it will form turf in good conditions but also forms clumps in its natural setting. That’s why I included the web info. I certainly don’t want to get into a divisive contest over grass. I am grateful for your comment.

@@brentbiles451 agreed the problem with common names is that they may mean different things in different areas.

I grew up on a ranch. We had horses, but I must be honest, we used a pickup about 99% of the time. My grandfather worked cattle in the days whne horses were still used. I didn't think to ask him much about what that was like. He passed nearly thirty years ago. Wish I had him here now.

Thank you.. Very kind.

Ethan "Edwards" not Hawke

I based my 20 mile number on a variety of sources. I do think horses in the 19th century worked more than what you see nowadays, even in modern Amish communities. For example, stage companies would change their teams about every fifteen miles. Another example would be cattle drives, which covered upwards of six or seven hundred miles and often took two months or more. A crew of eight cowboys (which is on the high side) would likely bring along fifty or more horses. I hesitated to put those number in my video, (there is a lot of variance) but I think most wranglers in the Old West era, both in terms of long cattle drives and stage lines limited their mounts work day to around two hours and fifteen miles or less. I know that sounds conservative, but the research I've done at least, seems to support the notion that to maintain an animal's health, fifteen to twenty miles is fairly accurate. I tried to include some stuff in my video about longer rides like the Tevis Cup, etc...

Sounds like a good mount. I've known only a handful of horses well. A couple of those were special to me, but I never had to depend upon one, like people did in the days before cars. Folks must have had a different mindset about travel, a notion I find interesting, as an author, trying to get my mind around the idea.

Yes I think if a horse is accustomed to work twenty or twenty-five miles is perfectly reasonable. When I mentioned the twenty mile number, I was trying to be conservative.. I'm going mostly by stuff I've read on the subject, but the twenty or thirty mile number fits my personal ecxperience. Did you notice the animals getting a bit more difficult to saddle in the mornings after a few days? My grandfather (dead now for over twenty years) worked a ranch as a boy, without a pickup. I wish I could have him around to ask some of these questions.

Thank you for sharing your experiences. The Yellowstone ride sounds fantastic That is such beautiful country.

I’ve had similar riding distances working cattle on large ranches.

I think this is an insightful comment. I never worked cattle from horseback. We always used a pickup. My grandfather, who passed over twenty years ago, worked on horseback when he was a young man. Wish I had thought to ask him more about .

​@@brentbiles451 Thank you for this video

Yup cowboys and packers even a generation ago didn't have big trucks and trailers and would ride 20 miles one way and then go to work.

That sounds like an amazing adventure. I've never been to Banff, but know it's beautiful country. My grandfather was a real cowboy, so when I read stories like yours I often think he must have had similar experiences, though he grew up working cattle in less mountainous terraine than Banff. Thank you so much, sincerely, for sharing your story.

You may be my biggest fan. I appreciate the comments at any rate. :)

I'd say that's an average horse. If you had a healthy fit horse, more. Are you a real cowgirl? I was raised on a ranch, but haven't done any cowboying for over thirty years.

@@brentbiles451 I am. Not as much as I was. Still have a horse👍

Thank you. You’re the second person who gave me the note. I’ll fix it.

oh wow you replied haha neat! I watched like 5 of your videos since then. They are really good. Keep it up, dude.

@@electronicsworkshawp I looked at your channel and subscribed. I like your videos. Interesting stuff and well made.

Thank you! Very kind.

I'm not sure I understand where your number of 90k comes from. Is that per year? Most historians put the number of Africans that were captured and enslaved between 1525 and 1866 at around 12.5 million. Just over 10 million went to the Americas, most going to Brazil or British-America (Southern Colonies now the US). By 1860, the number of enslaved blacks in the US was around 4.4 million. The total number of Africans who entered the US first under British, then American rule is an estimate 4 million.

I will further note that most enslaved Africans entered the current US under British rule. The US outlawed the importation of slaves in 1808. So perhaps your 90k comes from the number of entries that occurred under US rule?

I would love to see things as they were in the 1800s. It would be amazing if we had some film of the gigantic buffalo herds or documentary coverage of native cultures and their daily lives.

❤

Sounds like you and your family are dedicated to learning, which is admirable. Have your read Guns, Germs, and Steel?

Very kind of you.

They didn't do so knowingly or will ill--intent, but yes, diseases such as Yellow Fever, Measles, and Smallpox came to the Americas with European settlers (mainly Spanish and Portuguese Conquistadors) and slave traders.

Interesting question. There certainly weren't any diseases that killed millions of Europeans, whereas the illnesses brought by the Europeans led to an estimated 55 million deaths among Native cultures across the Americas. That includes South American groups like the Incas and all the hundreds of tribes across Central and North America. There were even deaths from Smallpox and other illnesses among the Inuit in Northern Canada.

I personally don't spend any time mentally litigating whether people's intentions were good or bad. There's nothing in the video about treaties, or who was good or bad. It's about how disease decimated Native cultures.Thanks for the comment.

@@brentbiles451 Muh poor injuns.

From my research there is concern about wild harvesting techniques and the disappearance of peyote growing in the wild. I understand that the plant is grown commercially and sourced in that way. Thanks for the informaton. I actually have a map of the growth region in the video. I meant to say Northern Mexico. (the Chihuahuan Desert) Sorry if I misspoke.

I just rewatched the video and I do slip up at one point and say New Mexico rather than Mexico. However, when I'm talking about the natural habitat of Peyote, I say Northern Mexico, which is the Chihuahuan Desert. I wasn't trying to be misleading on the matter. Thanks for your comment.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Morrison

th-cam.com/video/grZQNaAyFDo/w-d-xo.htmlsi=6wCZvTQAkdjvlU6v

I understand. In another of my videos I point out that there isn't (as far as I know) an extant photo of Peta Nocona. If you know of one, I'd love to see it. Apologies for the confusion.

At around 17:50 I note that there are no photos of Nocona (again that I am aware of, though I am no expert, nor do I have unlimited resources) th-cam.com/video/L4KyTwxpeIM/w-d-xo.html

@@brentbiles451 Hi + thanks for your reply :)

@@ivannio8519 Thank you for pointing out the discrepancy.

To be honest, in my novel Hunting Charm, there are numerous discrepancies. I take a good deal of artistic license where Nocona is concerned. I keep the timeline purposely vague, but it's a stretch historically that Nocona appears as a character in the story. The book is set in the early 1870s and Nocona probably died in 1864, though his wife, Cynthia Ann Parker swore that wasn't the case. It's just vague enough to work I suppose.

Interesting question.